Tier 1 Zeels - Zekrom BLW, Eelektrik NVI

Discussion in 'HS-on Archives' started by galladeava, Mar 6, 2012.

  1. wiki188

    wiki188 Mrlightning

    how is a zapdos tech instead of thundurus in a dce heavy list since the only thing it doesnt oko without plus power would be deinos, sableye, virizion, and 60 hp gible
  2. Bleak

    Bleak Glorious beacon of light Staff Member

    What would Zapdos be a tech for?

    Thundurus is a great starter and consistency booster. Is Zapdos really going to trump Thundurus' usefulness? I can't really think of anything that Zapdos can really bring to the table that a solid Zeels list isn't already doing.
  3. Monferno

    Monferno Rule #1: is that you gotta have fun

    Zapdos is bad and decks with Zapdos are bad.
    He requires more energy for a worse attack and when he's KO'd you just wasted a DCE you could use on a much more useful Mewtwo EX. T2 disaster volt is better than a 50 snipe, you're charging to thin the deck turn 1 and getting energy out on the field (assuming you have an eel or two out) turn 2-3.
    Just run thunderman
  4. Milky

    Milky Watercooling Veteran

    Thunderman is personal preference. I consistently T2 Bolt Strike the opponent's Thundurus while they struggle to Ultra Ball/Switch into their 1 Thunderman. Sure, Thunderman is great, but deck thinning and energy in the discard pile shouldn't be too hard if you run a solid energy count.
  5. Rowan

    Rowan Rum Pirate

    can someone explain to my why thunderous is so good? I just don't see it really. Other than the energy search.

    Also here is my list that I'm currently running. I did a bunch of changes

    Pokeon 16
    4-4 Tyanamo
    4 Zekrom
    1 Zekrom EX
    1 Raikou EX
    1 tornadus
    1 Terrakion

    Draw/Search 19
    4 Juniper
    3 Cilan
    4 Ultra ball
    4 Level ball
    1 heavy ball
    4 N

    Goodstuff 11
    2 Skarrow bridge
    3 Eviolite
    3 Potion
    3 Super rod
    2 Revive

    Energy 14
    2 DCE
    3 Prisim
    9 Lighting


    Thats where I stand currently

    My main attackers vary. almost always I have Zekrom. Tornadus is not the best but he is good to start with and against thouse trouble some fighting decks ilke terrakion and such. Zekrom ex does more damage than anything else in the deck with in reality no drawback. Raikou is a superstar and the best sniper in the game IMHO. I don't run cathces b/c I have not yet obtained them. if I had 4 catcher then I think he would be less useful but he is the very best I've got for dealing with disruption on the bench.
    and Terrakion is for the mirror match.

    A lot of people agree 4-4 is overkill but I like my deck maxed out right now. I can often set up a lot faster than others with this deck. One I get Mewtwos and catches I'll probably go 4-3. and I'll take out some trainers I don't know what.

    As for the search is pretty basic package except I run more cilan b/c I juniper turn 2 or use ultraballs more. I'll cut some of them when I get catcher.

    heavy ball is in there for a great free search for when I don't wanna discard to grap a terrakion or Zekrom Ex. usually terrakion.

    goodstuff and energy are pertty self explanitory. energy count a twinge high I guess but having DCE and prisim for Raikou makes it a 100 point sipe for 3 with no downside. not to mention I get free retreat on him all the time with this build.

    though I am very open to suggestions OTHER than mewtwo and catcher as I am attepting to get them now.
  6. Steven_Stone

    Steven_Stone New Member

    "Guaranteed" turn 2 80 is very strong. Like mentioned though Thundurus only works in some builds. For example in my current build I run 3 Switch, no Sky Arrows and only 2 free retreaters (out of 10 or so basics) so getting the turn 1 Charge with only 1 Thundurus in my deck will be hard to pull off. Builds that want to utilize Thundurus should play more than 1 copy and a lot of Switches and Sky Arrows. As a side note Thundurus deals with Empoleon more efficently than Zekrom but I don't expect Empoleon to see much play so it's a moot point.
  7. Angry_Brother

    Angry_Brother Almost any 6p member is ueban

    Before you won't get NIght spear 2 or 3 times.
    It's good idea, if you'll find space for it. Also, it could be useless against altariachomp, if you don't go first and don't have random spark on second turn. So only if you have some problems against mirror to ohko tynamos, but thundurus will destroy your zapdos too fast.
    All your opponent play Darkrai + something else? Ohkoing Tynamos, Gibles and Altarias without wasting cathcers really good.
    80 dmg on second turn always good.
  8. Reshiphlosion

    Reshiphlosion The Swarm

    my list is currently focused on early pressure with heavy thundurus (3 of em) to slap start up decks in the face. I also have 4-3 eels, I've been using this line since Spring Regs and I have to say, it's like the perfect number (tynamo spam :D ) this is what my pokemon line looks like:

    Pokemon: 15

    4-3 Eels
    3x Thundurus EPO
    2x Zekrom BLW
    2x Mewtwo EX
    1x Zekrom EX

    the weirdest thing about my pokemon line (and arguably my whole list) is my lack of Raikou EX, I don't believe I need him if I'm not going to run him in counts greater than 1 (the 1-of tech wasn't working for me) if I dropped the focus off Thundurus a bit and pulled out a catcher or something I could fit two or three of them... but that ruins my chances of a T1 Thundurus...

    Also I have 1 extra card to work with, originally I was going to put it into my supporter count to make it 4 N, 4 Juniper, 4 Bianca, and 2 RR but I'm not so sure if a 4th Bianca is needed, thoughts?
  9. Monferno

    Monferno Rule #1: is that you gotta have fun

    Take out Tornadus, he's underwhelming and a waste of space. Like you said you're "attempting" to get a Mewtwo, Mewtwo takes care of fighting just fine, you don't need Tornadus. If you're looking for a turn 2 80, you do that a lot easier with Thunderman.
    Cut Terrakion and the cards meant for him. Sure, Terrakion is nice to (sometimes, when it doesn't have eviolite) OHKO Darkrai, but he ruins consistency. Using an Eviolited Zekrom against a Darkrai works well.
    As great as Zekrom is, you don't need that many of him. I would cut at least one.
    4-3 or 3-3 Eels. When you're running 4 Ultra Ball AND 4 Level ball, there is /no/ reason you should be playing 4-4 Eels.
    Cilan is a bad card, a super super super terrible card and you only have eight draw supporters. Replace the Cilan with Cheren or Bianca.
    No Heavy Ball. Once again, with your Ultra Ball count you don't need it.
    Three super rod is over kill.
    Adding two revive to that three super rod is over-over kill.
    Potion is a waste. If you're using Potion because of Darkrai, just run some Max Potion - with Raikou, Max Potion/SkyArrow is greeeeeat.
    Run at least two Thunderman. You'll see the difference.
    Whenever you obtain Mewtwo, run at least two and up the DCE count to four.
    Bleak likes this.
  10. Milky

    Milky Watercooling Veteran

    3-3 Eels are ridiculous.

    Mewtwo doesnt take care of fighting just fine, because now every Terrakion list under the sun runs Mewtwo. Heck, I don't even think Tornadus EX is viable in light of Boufallant Terrakion Mewtwo variants.

    No Thunderman or 1 Thunderman. Space is better used for more energy / Mewtwo. 3 Mewtwo is what you want to aim for. Thunderman can be gotten with Ultra Ball Switch combos, so 2 is unnecessary. Heck, if you dislike him, don't run him at all.

    4-4 Balls are space consuming and clog up your hand. Hardly worth running 4 of either, 3 is sufficient.
  11. Monferno

    Monferno Rule #1: is that you gotta have fun

    I play three Mewtwo and 2 thunderman.
    Tornadus EX isn't viable, you're right about that.
    If you play 3-3 eels, 4 level ball is great. 3-3 eels is /not/ ridiculous. Space is so tight in the lists, you don't need to be running four of something you're only gonna need two of. ESPECIALLY if you're playing super rod. Super rod/3-3 or 4-3 eels/level ball, you're fine - as long as you aren't dumb and start dropping tynamos when you don't NEED to drop tynamos.
  12. Mr_Rumpleteezer

    Mr_Rumpleteezer Hovercat Mod Staff Member

    I think the ball count should be no less than 6 and no greater than 7. I've been running 3-3 Level/Ultra but am currently testing 2-4.
  13. Monferno

    Monferno Rule #1: is that you gotta have fun

    I agree, I only play six. 3/3 split currently, works pretty well.
  14. Reshiphlosion

    Reshiphlosion The Swarm

    I play 7 search cards

    4 ultra ball in the absence of J-arm and dual ball, then 3 level ball to get tynamo/eels whenever I need them...
  15. Milky

    Milky Watercooling Veteran

    But you were never supposed to Junk Arm for Ultra Ball? That's a five card discard.
  16. Nintendan

    Nintendan Scrub

    ^ I believe he's using Ultra Ball as another method to discard the Lightning Energy.
    No one would be silly enough to JArm Ultra Balls unless completely necessary XD
  17. Reshiphlosion

    Reshiphlosion The Swarm

    yes that's what I meant, J-Arm is gone so I upped my count of Ultra Ball to 4 so I can still discard energy as often...

    I would never J-Arm for an ultra ball unless I had 4-5 energy in my hand and 3 eels on the bench, lol
  18. Mr_Rumpleteezer

    Mr_Rumpleteezer Hovercat Mod Staff Member

    I honestly had to do this during the last round at Nationals. I needed my last Mewtwo and was not chancing it with Dual Ball. Won me the match!
  19. VinnySal

    VinnySal Member

    Just to add to the Thunderman argument...
    I just won a store tournament with the Pokemon lines:
    4 Tynamo (1 30 HP, 2 Thunderwave, 1 Spark)
    4 Eels
    2 Mewtwo
    1 Raikou
    3 Thundurus
    2 Bouffalant DRX
    Somehow I managed to squeak out the win vs. Terrakion/Garbodor in the last round.
  20. Reshiphlosion

    Reshiphlosion The Swarm

    I unfortunately can't find room for Raikou or tornadus EX in my build, so my deck is really strong against everything except mirror and garbo/terrakion.... :/