Kingdra Prime vs. Plus Power vs. Crobat G

Written by | July 12, 2010 | 35 comments | 3,219 views | Rating: 0

Everyone always needs that extra 10 damage here and there for the crucial KO and with the Unleashed Set came Kingdra Prime, the third way to get that extra 10 damage, to join the likes of the well known PlusPower and Crobat G.

Back when Platinum came out, Adam wrote an article about Crobat G vs Plus Power so I will try to focus this article on Kingdra Prime along with some things that were not mentioned before. Also, I will be assuming Kingdra Prime being used as a tech and not as a main attacker.

Some things that Kingdra Prime have going for it are that it has a good 130 HP, and the retreat cost of 1 isn’t too bad for a stage 2 tech. It has a pretty good 60 damage for 1 energy attack (given your opponent has no fire type Pokemon in play) if needed that can be used in a pinch if you run water / multi / rainbow energy in your deck. If you already run Rare Candy in your deck, it does not take up much deck space at all with a 1-0-1 or a 2-0-2 line depending on preference. And lastly, there is no limit to how many times you can use its power throughout a game (once per turn for however long it stays in play).

Kingdra Prime also has its disadvantages too. To start off, it’s a stage 2 Pokemon so it will be slower to get out on the field. Its x2 weakness to lightning is very unfavorable; it can be “Flash Bited” by Crobat G then “Bright Looked” and OHKO by Luxray GL LV.X with “Flash Impact”, to give an example. Its power can only be used once per turn, and it has the potential to be “Power Sprayed”. And it also takes up bench space.

Overall, I think that Kingdra Prime can be a very good tech. It can easily be slipped into any deck that already uses Rare Candies, and its high HP will keep it away from being an easy prize.

Next I will quickly run through the major ups and downs of PlusPower and Crobat G.

PlusPower pros:
- no bench space needed
- does not take up much deck space
- can be stacked in one turn
- applied before weakness, so for x2 weakness it actually adds 20 more damage

PlusPower cons:
- it can’t be searched out
- it can’t be used if you are trainer locked
- it only does extra damage to the active Pokemon, given that you use a damaging attack
- it can only be used once, unless attacked to a Pokemon like Shuppet or Uxie

Crobat G pros:
- it can be reused multiple times and stacked with Poke Turns and Super Scoop Ups
- it’s a basic Pokemon that can be searched out, along with Poke Turn
- it has free retreat
- it can be used to KO Pokemon and take prizes during your turn before your attack

Crobat G cons:
- it can take up a lot of deck space and/or bench space
- it can be Power Sprayed and power locked
- it can be an easy prize for your opponent
- its attacking potential isn’t too good

My personal favorite of these 3 is Crobat G; PlusPower only does extra damage to the active Pokemon, and Kingdra Prime is a little slower and can’t be stacked as well. I think Crobat G is the easiest to get out, and can be devastating when stacked and combined with Poke Turns.

An example of this happened during States this year. I was running my Magnezone deck and I was playing against a Gyarados deck. Early in the game, I had an Expert Belted Magnezone LV.X out, my tank with 160 HP. Next turn, my opponent brings up Gyarados, belts it, drops 2 Crobat Gs and 3 Poke Turns, and OHKOs my belted Magnezone LV.X with “Tail Revenge”.

So, which of these 3 ways of adding that extra damage do you think is the best to use in the upcoming format? Debate, and thanks for reading.

Image Credits: PokeBeach, Pokegym, and Pokemon Paradijs

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  • JPN-Gallade

    In my opinion, I really think that Crobat is the best for adding damage. The fact it can lay damage counters on any Pokemon the moment it comes into play makes it pretty good. Sure Kingdra Prime can do that too, but Crobat seems to be a bit easier to use since it can use PokeTurns, and it is easy to pull out, for it is essentially an easily searchable pluspower. The only downside I see with it is Power lock.

    So yeah, I personally think that Crobat G is the best compared to Kingdra Prime and Pluspower.

  • espy87

    both. together.

    but outside of a kingdra prime deck? always crobat.

  • SkyAoiSora

    You should include your reasoning for this. Unless, it won't be much use for us to read your comment… Furthermore, you said “both” when there were three cards debated…..

    And I think that the Kindra could be included in a deck with rare candies, as Joe stated in his article. That, or if you could run some SSU's (especially if you omit Uxie from your deck), run a BTS or two, and a 1-1-1 or a 2-2-2 line, then you could take advantage of adding an extra 1 dmg counter per turn. …Hmm… But now that I think of that, if you're going to do that you'd might as well run poke-blower+'s… Oh well, in this case you can run 4-4 SSU/PB+. :P I guess it would depend on what kind of deck you're running. *Shrugs* I'm thinking out loud here.

    Personally, I think Crobat is by far the best because it's so easy to play. I also think that if you run only 1 crobat and 4 SSU, especially in a deck with SP's such as GarC Lv. X, it plays very nicely for the potential donks or KO snipes. (It's what I'm playing right now with EnteixRaikou Legend, as a fun deck =])

    Pluspower could be a worthy addition though, I think… Same for Buck's Training, a card possibly forgotten in this article? Finally, another insane card to not overlook is that new supporter coming out in the set called Clash at the Summit. If you have more prize cards left than your opponent, your pokemon's attack this turn does 40 more damage. I think that supporter will see an insane amount of play in decks such as Kingdra Prime, GarC Lv. X, Luxchomp, Donkphan, etc. etc…

  • tweedmoore

    You mentioned that kingdra's power cannot be stacked. I don't believe that is correct.

  • SkyAoiSora

    Care to elaborate with some examples?

  • tweedmoore

    sky…not sure if you mean to reply to me or the main thread. But If i have 3 kingdra prime in play I can use “Spray Splash” poke power 3 times. I can stack all 3 on one pokemon if i like or spread them out over various poke.

  • SkyAoiSora

    No no, I meant to reply to you. See when you said that I only thought of 1 Kingdra Prime at a time ('Cause I'm not very rich and can't afford that many cards.. ^_^”) so I didn't think of the possibility of “stacking” with multiple of its effects. And if I wanted to reply to the thread, I wouldn't have clicked reply on your post. :P

  • Rhin

    I higly doubt that supporter will see much play, specially in SP decks who already run the all important Cyrus´s conspiracy.
    If you use that card, you cant use cyrus, and it only works if you are losing the game. Also, 40 damage onle once, isnty all that spectacular, and im sure it only applies to damage to the active pokemo9n, so garchomp wont use it.
    Back on topicc, i prefer crobat over kingdra. Its faster, easy to search and use, can be re used with poketurn or ssu, it doesnt have a retreat cost, so using it with call energy can get you out going even with a bad start, i think its the best choice even in non SP decks.

  • Peter

    Crobat G should be used in almost all decks that is meant to donk early lol. Kingdra Prime deck should also use Crobat G for that extra 10 dmg they can add. I like both very much as Kingdra Prime is not an easy prize target, I can use it every turn, I can even use it twice on 1 turn if i get head on scoop up with BTS out lol (i've done it). Also Kingdra Prime is a good attacker too (assuming your not up against chrizard). But for all other decks that doesn't use Kingda Prime as primary or secondary attacker, Crobat G > Plus Power > Kingdra PRime

  • espy87

    well let's review, i never mentioned plus power and i said crobat is the best.
    for now, kingdra is a waste of time and space outside of a straight kingdra deck or possibly a water deck(i tried him instead of crobat and he was a nice option but crobats are just soo easy to get out)

    and when i said BOTH, i meant Crobat and Kingdra together; you could probably average 30-40 a turn with them together, plus a snipe attack would fit fell.

  • SkyAoiSora

    “ok let's review, i never mentioned plus power and i said crobat is the best.”

    …dude chill… o3o I just asked for a specification because before you said “both. together.” (which isn't very detailed or specific to begin with), you hadn't mentioned any cards at all… I just find that sometimes comments on forums are a little vague. That's all. I think Pluspower is a card that could be used especially when you find yourself 10 dmg short of taking out a tank or something. Sure, you could use Crobat instead, but if you run a deck that focuses on Spreading damage that isn't placed with attacks, then running all of them would be ideal. I guess it just depends on the deck. =]

  • SkyAoiSora

    But if you're up against Fire, you only lose 20 damage from the attack's base damage, right? Then you get weakness, which is +10-+40, and now with all the new cards it's x2 all the time. So at most, you lose 10 dmg from fighting fire. …Right? So will fighting fire change your outcome that much? o3o I mean especially if the deck's designed to donk early, and take advantage of Crobats and KingdraP's pokepower and all that? What's your opinion taking those factors under consideration? =]

  • quaziko

    Once Gardy leaves, there's only negligible Power lock including Power Spray in SP. Thus, Kingdra's would be better since you can use it each turn.

  • JPN-Gallade

    But you may need to remember that the downside of Kingdra is that it is a stage 2, and it ends up taking some of your bench like Nidoqueen. Crobat doesn't have that problem that much since it can use PokeTurn, but as for Kingdra, it may not be that much of a problem when the new supporter card Hunter comes out.

    Well, remember, it is based off opinion. Simply, I prefer Crobat over Kingdra, but I still think that Kingdra and Pluspower are good too. Like for me, I think that Kingdra could work in non SP decks, as there is the possibility of running a 1-0-1 line of it.

  • http://www.adamcapriola.com/ Adam Capriola

    I agree with you Joe, I like Crobat because you can play a bunch in one turn to get a KO.

    But I haven't tried Kingdra out, so I guess if you get it out early enough you could just plan for KOs by dropping a damage counter each turn.

    Getting it out seems like it may be an issue though.

  • Rhin

    Read carefully kingdra´s attack. It says the damage from dragon pump goes from 60 to 20, so you lose 40 damage, not 10.
    With weakness x2 it goes to 40, meaning you lose 20 damage, not including expert belt.

  • Joe

    I guess Buck's Training slipped my mind, but it doesn't compare to the other 3 at all. It has most of the same downsides as plus power, and also you can only play one per turn and it takes up your supporter for the turn.

  • Joe

    I said it couldn't be “stacked as well”, not that it is unstackable. And I don't know if having 2 out as tecks would be worth it really, unless you really have the bench space for it and need the 20 extra damage a turn. You would either need the stage 1, taking up more deck space, or to use 2 of your 3-4 rare candies, possibly needed for your main attackers, to get them out.

  • tweedmoore

    flygon deck would prefer kingdra

  • bittyboy52/72

    Not true! If anybody can find a way to run it there is still Glacion Lock.

  • pikkdogs

    In the coming format there is no debate.

    It is crobat

    Right now the only good decks after rotation seem to be SP and really fast stage 1 decks. And Crobat G fits well in each of them.

    Plus Power gets used up too quickly and stage 2 decks are too slow as it is not mentioning the addition of another stage 2.

  • SkyAoiSora

    Maybe, but I personally don't think that's very widely used, no? Well, at least in my region it isn't. I don't know about yours. *Shrugs*

  • SkyAoiSora

    Yea, I'm aware that it's not the best choice since it uses up your supporter for the turn but it does compensate by giving you two cards in addition to the “plus power”. But, on the other hand, if you're doing well for your draw power for the turn and you can afford to use a Buck's training, and if you're running a deck where the point is to stack as much dmg as possible, then it could be useful, no? =]

    In the end I think these cards seriously depend on what style of deck you're running.

  • SkyAoiSora

    Oooooh I thought it went from 60 to 40… Ok yea that is indeed a pretty big downside. I'm sorry I didn't read the card correctly… ^_^”

  • Sledd

    I really think it depends on what deck you're playing. In Kingdra, I run Pluspower because Kingdra's power can already be sprayed, so I'll use plus power along side KIngdra in a Kingdra deck. In Jumpluff, I use 1 Crobat G because bench space can often be hard to get, so i'll use one of those along side a few plus powers. In SP, Crobat all the way. Sablock will use Crobat as well. Donphan will most likely use Pluspower to prevent a Crobat start.

  • http://www.adamcapriola.com/ Adam Capriola

    Just to note on that, a Crobat start is usually a decent start for most
    decks. Free retreat and 80 HP is always good. I haven't played with
    Donphan but I'm assuming a Crobat start is ok. It's better than starting
    with something that has a retreat cost.

  • Eddie North

    Or you can make a Kingdra Prime/ Gengar deck?
    That would let you use all of them

  • blooper785

    i think crobat g is the best out of the three but what bout shiftry from rising rivals its seal off attck is the same as gardys but its 2 colorless and one deck a new deck mabye?

  • Mewuk85

    Yeah, but the whole point of a kingdra deck is to set up extremely fast and donk, with spray splash, ebelt, plus power. but to add poketurns would just take up deck space. when you already run SSU. I know you mean for a “SP” side.

    I think if you run crobat g you should run maybe 2 for emergency situations, but the point is spray splash you don’t want to fill up your bench with crobats and only have 1 spray splash……….

    Just a thought personal opinion. :):):):):)

  • mewuk85

    Most definitely agreed.

  • mewuk85

    I think a Ttar Flygon deck is going to come into play next format sense were loosing moonlight. be like FlyTar.

  • mewuk85

    If you made a line up of 4-3-4 kingdra assuming 2 or 3 of them were primes, and your claydol/baltoy – uxies, maybe an azelf. would “ANY ONE OUT THEIR” tell me if it would be necessary to run a 1-1-1 or 1-0-1 Exploud SV line for benched with His poke body?

  • mewuk85

    okay!!! i have been playing a kingdra with these techs for a while you dont really need cyrusis its a waste of deck space. just need 4 plus power 2 crobat's and 2 to 3 poketurns. luxray i want to try 1-1 line maybe but then i would tech in sp radar to grab for bright look. but other than that. i win about 8 out of 10 different matches.

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