Speculations on 2011-2012 Deck Archetypes

The title says it all, really. This thread is meant to list and discuss possible deck archetypes that would become popular play after this year's rotation. I'm going to need a lot of help in making this list, especially since I plan to make an article about this. So far, this is what I have:

• BearPlume (Beartic and Vileplume)
  - Bash / Lock / Tank
  - Good Set-Up Speed
  - Good Momentum
  - Good Recovery
  
• BlastGatr (Blastoise and Feraligatr Prime)
  - Bash / Snipe / Tank
  - Bad Set-Up Speed
  - Excellent Momentum
  - Good Recovery
  
• Cappuccino (Cincinno and Zoroark)
  - Bash / Donk
  - Excellent Set-Up Speed
  - Good Momentum
  - Excellent Recovery
  
• DonChamp (Donphan Prime and Machamp Prime)
  - Bash / Donk / Tank
  - Good Set-Up Speed
  - Excellent Momentum
  - Good Recovery
  
• DonkPhan (Donphan Prime)
  - Donk / Tank
  - Excellent Set-Up Speed
  - Good Momentum
  - Excellent Recovery
  
• FeraTurn (Feraligatr Prime and Lanturn Prime)
  - Bash / Tank
  - Good Set-Up Speed
  - Excellent Momentum
  - Good Recovery
  
• Gothitelle (Gothitelle)
  - Bash / Lock
  - Excellent Set-Up Speed
  - Good Momentum
  - Good Recovery
  
• HeaLix (Steelix Prime and Blissey Prime)
  - Bash / Heal / Tank
  - Good Set-Up Speed
  - Excellent Momentum
  - Bad Recovery
  
• Jumpluff (Jumpluff and Sunflora)
  - Bash / Donk
  - Good Set-Up Speed
  - Excellent Momentum
  - Good Recovery
  
• KingBuzz (Kingdra Prime and Mandibuzz)
  - Bash / Spread / Snipe
  - Good Set-Up Speed
  - Excellent Momentum
  - Good Recovery
  
• KingPhan (Kingdra Prime and Donphan Prime)
  - Bash / Donk / Snipe
  - Good Set-Up Speed
  - Good Momentum
  - Good Recovery
  
• KyuGatr (Kyurem and Feraligatr Prime)
  - Bash / Spread / Tank
  - Good Set-Up Speed
  - Excellent Momentum
  - Good Recovery
  
• LostGar (Gengar Prime, Seeker, and Lost World)
  - Donk / Spread / LZ
  - Good Set-Up Speed
  - Excellent Momentum
  - Good Recovery
  
• MagneBoar (Magnezone Prime and Emboar)
  - Bash / Engine / Tank
  - Good Set-Up Speed
  - Excellent Momentum
  - Bad Recovery
  
• MagneGatr (Magnezone Prime and Feraligatr Prime)
  - Bash / Engine / Tank
  - Good Set-Up Speed
  - Excellent Momentum
  - Bad Recovery
  
• MagneGrowth (Magnezone Prime and Tangrowth)
  - Bash / Engine / Lock / Tank
  - Good Set-Up Speed
  - Good Momentum
  - Bad Recovery
  
• MewPluff (Mew Prime and Jumpluff)
  - Bash / Donk
  - Excellent Set-Up Speed
  - Good Momentum
  - Good Recovery
  
• ReshiBoar (Reshiram, Emboar, and Ninetales)
  - Bash / Engine / Tank
  - Good Set-Up Speed
  - Excellent Momentum
  - Good Recovery
  
• SamuGatr (Samurott and Feraligatr Prime)
  - Bash / Snipe / Tank
  - Good Set-Up Speed
  - Good Momentum
  - Good Recovery
  
• Scizor Prime (Scizor Prime)
  - Bash / Tank
  - Excellent Set-Up Speed
  - Excellent Momentum
  - Good Recovery
  
• ShayPerior (Shaymin, Serperior, and Max Revive)
  - Bash / Heal / Tank
  - Excellent Set-Up Speed
  - Good Momentum
  - Good Recovery
  
• TanBoar (Tangrowth and Emboar)
  - Bash / Lock / Tank
  - Good Set-Up Speed
  - Good Momentum
  - Good Recovery
  
• TanPerior (Tangrowth, Serperior, Shaymin, and Max Revive)
  - Bash / Heal / Lock / Tank
  - Good Set-Up Speed
  - Excellent Momentum
  - Excellent Recovery
  
• TyphRam (Typhlosion Prime, Reshiram, and Ninetales)
  - Bash / Engine / Tank
  - Good Set-Up Speed
  - Excellent Momentum
  - Excellent Recovery
  
• Tyranitar (Tyranitar Prime and Zoroark)
  - Bash / Spread / Tank
  - Good Set-Up Speed
  - Excellent Momentum
  - Good Recovery
  
• ZekromIsu (Zekrom, Pachirisu, and Shaymin)
  - Bash / Donk / Tank
  - Excellent Set-Up Speed
  - Excellent Momentum
  - Good Recovery

Bash - A deck strategy that relies on dealing a consistent heavy damage to Knock Out the opponent's Defending Pokémon and take Prizes.
Donk - A deck strategy that relies on Knocking Out the opponent's Defending Pokémon in 1-3 turns before he/she could properly set-up other Pokémon on his/her Bench. The player automatically wins the game if the opponent doesn't have another Pokémon in the Bench to replace his/her Defending Pokémon that was just Knocked Out. This always involves Basic or Stage 1 Pokémon with relatively powerful attacks that require little or no Energy.
Engine - A deck strategy that relies on a card or a set of cards to provide consistent draw power. Decks that involve this strategy most often have excellent momentum.
Heal - A deck strategy that relies on removing damage counters from the player's Pokémon to prevent the opponent from taking Prizes. This usually involves using a certain Pokémon Ability or attack.
Lock - A deck strategy that relies on preventing the opponent from doing a certain action (e.g. using Trainer cards) while usually dealing a moderate amount of damage, disrupting his/her deck's momentum. This usually involves using a certain Pokémon Ability or attack.
LZ - A deck strategy that does not rely on taking Prizes but on placing the opponent's Pokémon into the Lost Zone. This always involves the Stadium card "Lost World". The player automatically wins the game if he/she plays Lost World when the opponent has at least six Pokémon in the Lost Zone.
Momentum - A measurement on the ability of a deck sticking to its primary strategy (or strategies) every turn after properly setting up.
Recovery - This refers to the ability of a deck to recover its momentum after being knocked out of it.
Set-Up - This refers to the point in time (measured by the number of turns) that a player gets to bring out the key components of his/her deck's primary strategy (or strategies) out into play.
Snipe - A deck strategy that relies on Knocking Out the opponent's weaker Pokémon to take Prizes, usually those sitting on the Bench.
Spread - A class of deck that relies on spreading damage (damaging multiple Pokémon at one time) for easier Knock Outs.
Tank - A deck strategy that relies on Pokémon with high HP and/or lowering the opponent's damage output per turn with an Ability, attack or Trainer (Item, Stadium, and Supporter) cards. This prevents the opponent from performing one-hit Knock Outs and taking Prizes easily.

It's not much right now, but I hope everyone can help contribute in expanding this list.

mewpluff and Tangboar are another two possible decks

Testing showed me HGSS-on decks lose a lot of consistency; therefore, I feel any fire deck with Ninetales for draw power looks like a top play. Yes, trainers can be played on the first turn and will help but show me where the speed trainers are HGSS-on...

in a meta that looses important supporters, trainers will grow importance... so a good trainer lock deck could be strong

Since the format has slowed down some, I think lostgar with vileplume will be something to check out. professor elms semi replaces spiritomb as far as searching for those evolutions, and rare candy while nerfed could still help. (rare candy in hand, use proffessor elms to search for stage 2, rare candy straight to stage 2.) not AS effective but not bad. I will still miss the constant trainer lock though =(

Engineer's are the speed supporter for draw power and using noctowl or magnezone for the new uxie. hence why the format is slowed so much.

I think its going to be fun. Im working on DonChamp and Lostgar atm

I think a deck that has both zekrom and reshirom as main attackers could work.

I see. Is the rotation really going to be HGSS and up? What about TanPerior? It's a deck based on Tangrowth from Call of Legends and Serperior from Black & White. I talked about it earlier on an article I made a few weeks ago.

-Magnezone/Pachirisu: You could even use Zekrom as a starter. If not Zekrom, than something like Stantler or Pichu to get basics on the bench turn one.
-MagneGatr: This one definitely needs to have a starter like Stantler.
-MagneGrowth: Open with Tangela. Nutritional support turn one and double colorless turn two and hit for 80. Set up Magnezone Prime on the bench and Lost Burn to close out the game.

-Reshiram/Emboar: Reshiram would obviously be the preferred starter. This would have two ability Emboars and two regular. Reshiram just does not hit hard enough for a strong mid game.
-Reshiram/Typhlosion: Same as above including two Typhlosion Primes and two regular. The 120 damage from Reshiram is nice, but you are really going to need to hit for more than that.

-Steelix or Scizor with Skarmory starter.

-LostGar: I really do think that this deck could see a revival. You can open with Mime Jr and Lost Zone random stuff from the top of their deck. Then by turn three you could Hurl stuff all over the place. Include Slowking and Spiritomb.

-A multitude of Cinccino. This attacker could be the focus of a deck or the tech to cover weakness. It is very flexible.

-Straight Donphan Prime.

-Maybe even a Wailord deck.

Random thoughts:
-I do think that Zekrom and Reshiram are going to be very solid starters, but I'm not too sure how dominate they will be. So what if Pokemon Catcher is added to the format. These two cards can only hit for 20 damage turn one if and only if you open with a double colorless energy. The damage does not rise until you hurt them. It will most likely be turn three until they can hit for 120. I think their true value lies in the fact that they are strong "wall" Pokemon. they will be able to stall for several turns early in the game due to their hp.
-I do not think that Stage 2 decks will be at a substantial disadvantage to the Stage 1 decks. Yes, rare candy was nerfed. However, this merely slowed Stage 2 deck down to Stage 1 speeds. People are talking alot about Donphan Prime. Yes it can hit for 60 on turn two, but with Rare Candy I can set up a Stage 2 on turn two and hit back hard.
-I did not list one, but a well built trainer-goods lock deck will be powerful.
-I really feel that good ole Switch will be in a lot decks. I also think that Energy Exchanger, Energy Search, Energy Retrieval will be in a lot of decks.
-I would also go buy a Noctowl if I were you. It is cheap right now ($.59 on T&T) and could become a semi-staple.

I'll update this list when I get back home. I'm in Hong Kong right now. Anyway, what's LostGar's future going to be like without the Gengar from Stormfront, the Spiritomb from Arceus, and Gengar LV.X?

I think its future looks uncertain. It still has lots of ways to lost zone pokemon, and can set up quickly, but I think toolbox Tyranitar will be a threat in the format, and it's not going to be "really fast". Zekrom and Donchamp will be the big decks with advantages over it.

Most underrated right now: Blastgatr. With all the collecting, communicating, great balling, and resetting, plus Mantine, it can pretty much guarantee a full setup turn 3 - or 4 off of a couple Judges - that's almost as fast as it is now. Hitting Donphan for weakness, and being really bulky helps it out, and I don't believe Zekrom is the autoloss people think it is. Zoroark REALLY shores up the matchup as far as revenge killing goes, as could Bouffalant, both solid reasons to run DCE, which also increases consistency on your Blastoise setups, as you don't need to hit Gatr and 4 waters to go off. You can snipe, and hit the gatr next turn to reload, which is a BIG jump. Zekrom also keeps a lot of free prizes on its bench, in the form of Pachirisu and Shaymin. Preventing him from scooping up Shaymins to reload is a key to a late-game win, as he has to dig for Flower Shop Lady _AND_ another Collector/Communication to get them out of his deck, then still scoop up a Pachi AND find energy. Zekrom is an early game deck that can run out of gas if you can keep it from taking too many early prizes.

The deck also EATS Donchamp which helps a lot.

Most Overrated right now: Fire. The ninetales engine helps consistency at the cost of matchup benefits across the board. While Donphan doesn't look bad, and you can hopefully counter-Outrage against a Zekrom start, that 3-energy requirement means a lot of things set up faster than you do. Is it a bad deck? NO. Is it tier 1? I have my doubts. There may only be one tier 1 deck (Donchamp), Lostgar may break in, or the tiers may be wider than I expect and the game will be very interesting.

Here's one for you: Kingdra Prime tech in Blastgatr. Do you guys think it's playable, or does it get in the way too much early on to be worth having around? I really don't expect a dedicated Kingdra deck to come up, but I could be wrong.

testing showed reshirboar pwns with a turn 2 setup with a good hand. turn 3 with normal and turn 4 bad. donphan will be another good deck. zekromichu will probably be tier 2. and ninetales is not overated. also how does he cost you matches. donchamp is decent and probably tier 1 but is it the boss we think it is? well only time will tell. BTW smeargle is still in format

I made a list: MagBoar, Lostgar, Fastoise/Blastgatr, Donchamp/Donphan Variants, Steelix*, Scizor Variants, Reshiboar/Reshiram Variants, Ursaring Variants, Mewcario, Magnezone Variants**, Wailgatr, Ampharos Variants***, Zekrom Variants, Bearplume, Cinccino, Samurott, more

* I think Steelix is done. Too much fire, no matter how many Sp. Metals it has on it, it's still one-shot.
** I really think Electrode Prime helps out Magnezone a lot, and Magnetrode is going to be at least somewhat popular.
*** Despite not receiving much hype, Ampharos counters Emboar and Feraligatr, two cards needed a bunch for popular decks.

I think Tangrowth is receiving far too much hype, if any deck. It's weak to what appears to be the most popular type in the format, and stacking energies typically isn't a great idea.

The meta-game varies in each community, and I think that we shouldn't remove deck archetypes that may not become popular play in some of these communities. Which Tangrowth are we talking about? I was thinking of pairing up Tangrowth from Call of Legends with Serperior from Black & White. Disregarding Fire-type decks, what do you think?

I want to know whether Zekromichu or Reshiboar is better, they are both probably gonna be teir 1/ 2.5.

indercative: I said the engine costs you matches because you're playing heavy in fire, a colour that doesn't really give you much this season.

I don't think Reshiboar is going to be tier 1. If anything, the "big setup" will be off of Typhlosion, not Emboar - being able to pull that fire energy you pitch to turn 2 ninetales back up to make your turn 2 Blue Flare is invaluable imo. Fire's strength this season is consistency: you need to play to that, not gamble on hitting energy draws and spewing them out with Emboar.

Magnetrode is something I consider sketchy; I haven't found anything that really stands out with Magnezone yet, and we'll see if it's actually going to be The Deck like people speculated a few months ago or if it's going to be binder fodder.

Ampharos Prime is a sexy tech against a LOT of things this format; I'm tempted to snag a couple while they're still cheap. I don't see it as a main attacker, but if you do get two on the board, fire scoops. The problem is...what deck has the slots to run them? Magnezone? Is this the dawn of Toolbox Lightning?

I think what Magnetrode really has going for it is (near) free use of Twins, and its ability to use Black Belt to conserve energy. I also consider it faster than Magnegatr seeing as it only needs one Stage-2 and not two.

EDIT: Also, I don't think Ampharos can be run as an efficient tech in most decks. But looking at Mammoswine from Triumphant, it might have potential as a core support.

A spread deck definitely wants it, but the question is: can we MAKE a good spread deck in this format? Honestly if you're using Mamoswine to spread, why not use Tyranitar?

I would prefer Mamoswine because it could be paired up with Feraligatr Prime. That's just me, though.