Two for One – Different Takes on Floatzel UL

Written by | May 29, 2011 | 29 comments | 2,631 views | Rating: +7

Hey 6P readers. Today’s article is about two of my personal favorite decks for the HGSS-on format. I have only used cards that we already have. Meaning that I am not speculating on what cards might come out in future sets (i.e. Pokémon Catcher and Beatric). I find both of these decks to be extremely fun to play and both have produced at least respectable testing results early.

I am going to give my actual lists. These lists absolutely are not perfect. They can easily be improved upon. I just want to get a couple of ideas discussed further.

Blastoise/Floatzel

I cannot take credit for discovering this deck. My inspiration was David Reichenberger’s article. His article lays out a very solid base for this deck in a HGSS-on format. For this deck, I am going to present two deck lists. I will not go into great detail on this deck since David did such a good job of that.

List 1: Consistency
Pokemon – 20 

4 Cleffa HS/CL
4 Squirtle UL
2 Wartortle UL
4 Blastoise UL
3 Buizel UL
3 Floatzel UL

 Trainers – 24 

4 Pokémon Collector
4 Pokémon Communication
3 Pokémon Reversal
2 Professor Juniper
3 Professor Oak’s New Theory
4 Rare Candy
4 Switch

 Energy – 16 

12 Water
4 Double Colorless

This deck is built for speed. You might be wondering how a deck based off of Stage 2 and a Stage 1 lines can be built for speed. Well, just try this list out. With Cleffa, Professor Oak’s New Theory, and Professor Juniper, you easily play through 4-6 six card hands in your first 3 turns. Very rarely do you miss the set up by turn three. Sometime you can even be up and sniping by turn two.

It is important to note, this deck is not an autoloss to Magnezone and Zekrom. Yes, it will lose most of the time. However, if you can get the turn two set up and start sniping, this deck can exchange prizes with both of those decks. Taking out an early Magnemite/Magneton is invaluable, and Zekrom decks leave too many weak support Pokémon on the bench as snipe bait.

There are a few cards that I would like to point out:

Pokémon Reversal: This card is very good and very disruptive. You do not even need to use it for taking a prize card, but you can use it as a stall tactic. Bringing up a Tepig, Pachirisu, etc. can easily set your opponent ba ck by a full turn.

Professor Juniper: There are only two of these in the deck. I honestly thought about taking them out and replacing them with Judge. Juniper is nice late game, but early game it is not helpful. With Cleffa as your active, it is too tempting to forego the Juniper and just Eeeeeeek for the turn. I could see Judge being much more useful in the early game. I am still testing it and have not come to a decision.

List 2:  Teched and Loaded
Pokemon – 24 

4 Cleffa HS/CL
4 Squirtle UL
2 Wartortle UL
4 Blastoise UL
3 Buizel UL
3 Floatzel UL
2 Makuhita UD
2 Hariyama UD

 Trainers – 19 

3 Pokémon Collector
4 Pokémon Communication
2 Professor Juniper
3 Professor Oak’s New Theory
4 Rare Candy
3 Switch

 Energy – 17 

9 Water
4 Double Colorless
4 Rainbow

This version is set up to give the deck more options against lightning based decks. It is still fast, but you lose the potential early game disruption of Pokémon Reversal.

Hariyama: I know everyone is going to flame me for not using Donphan Prime. I get it. The Prime has a sweet Poke-Body, it has 20 more HP, and it can attack for one Fighting energy. However, it only hits for 60 AND it damages your bench. The single energy attack is not that big of a deal with this deck.

If you have a Floatzel and a Blastoise in play, you can energize Hariyama in one turn. You just use Blastoise to move one Rainbow Energy and two Water Energy to an active Hariyama. Then start swinging. For the one Rainbow Energy and two Water Energy, you hit for 60 (or 120 against Lightning decks).

However, for two Rainbow Energy and two Water Energy you hit for 80 or 100 with 20 done to Hariyama. This turns into 160 or 200 against Lightning Decks. This will OHKO every Lightning Pokemon in the game.

The other bonus is that Hariyama is $.25 on Troll and Toad, Donphan Prime is $11.99. This offers a cheap alternative to players on a budget. People have been talking about using Marowak as a cheap Donphan Prime replacement.

It runs on CC and allows you to flip two coins, doing 60 times the number of heads. For most decks, I would say that Marowak is worth it. However, since the energy can be moved around in the deck easily, I would go with Hariyama.

(I debated about using the regular Donphan from HGSS. Donphan’s attack, Double Spin, says, “Flip 2 coins. This attack does 70 damage times the number of heads.” Therefore, on average you will do 70 straight damage, factor in Lightning’s weakness to Fighting, and BOOM you just hit for 140.That will OHKO EVERY Lighting Pokémon in the game. Donphan Prime cannot do that without three Fighting Energy.

Heck, if you get lucky and hit double heads, it will do a straight 140 damage that can OHKO almost everything in the format. That way Donphan can serve as a last resort attacker and not just a Lightning counter. Let me know your thought about this option. It also has a -20 Lightning resistance.

So, if you are facing a Magnezone Prime, you will force them to Lost Zone three energy instead of just two. Against Magnezone Prime decks, that can be huge since energy management is vital.

You could also look into Lucario CL.)

Rainbow Energy: This is obviously for the Fighting Energy costs of Hariyama’s attack. It can be used in conjunction with Blastoise’s Wash Out Poke-Power to power up Hariyama in a single turn.

I honestly think that this deck has a place in the metagame, especially if the format changes before US National and the World Championships. It runs over the deck many people believe could be the BDIF (Reshiram/Emboar). It can fairly easily tech against its weakness. It is consistent. It punishes your opponent for any misplay by sniping the bench.

Matchups:

Donphan: Favorable. It hits Donphan for weakness. It is fast enough to not fall too far behind.

ReshiBoar or ReshiPhlosion: Highly Favorable. This deck has steam rolled basically every build centered on Reshiram that I have seen. It easily takes out Reshiram’s support pieces and makes the deck falter in the prize exchange.

Zekrom: Unfavorable/Highly Unfavorable. The weakness hurts. Zekrom is also one of the few decks that is consistently faster than BlastZel. It can cripple BlastZel early. If you run the teched version, it is not impossible to win; it just takes a very well played game.

Magnezone Variants: Slightly Unfavorabe/Unfavorable. If BlastZel can snipe the early Magnemites/Magnetons this game can be won. The teched in Hariyama can really help this deck. If the opponent is not ready to trade prizes for about four consecutive turns (which Magnezone can struggle with if they misplay energies) it has a good chance to win.

Cinccino: Very Favorable. It just hits too hard for Cinccino.

LostGar: Even/Slightly Unfavorable. If it is the Mew variant, you lose the speed advantage. You also run a high Pokémon count. There will almost always be Pokémon in your hand.

Magnezone/Floatzel/Vileplume

This is the deck that I am really enjoying right now. I know that people who are in Magnezone’s corner are pairing it with Emboar. I know that a lot of people might disagree with using Floatzel. Please just try it out and then make a decision.

The purpose of this deck is to get Magnezone Prime onto the field with two Floatzel on the bench. Then you can play three energy per turn to deal 150 damage and knock out basically everything. The Vileplume is the secondary focus. However, if you can get it set up in a solid amount of time (by turn 3 or 4), it really skews many games your way. Let’s see the deck list:

Pokemon – 23 

4 Cleffa HS/CL
3 Buizel UL
3 Floatzel UL
3 Magnemite TM
3 Magneton TM
3 Magnezone Prime TM
2 Oddish UD
1 Gloom UD
2 Vileplume UD

 Trainers – 19 

2 Interviewer’s Questions
3 Judge
3 Pokémon Collector
4 Professor Elm’s Training Method
2 Professor Oak’s New Theory
4 Rare Candy

 Energy – 18 

5 Lightning Energy
3 Rescue Energy
10 Water Energy

Cleffa: It is the starting Pokémon for the deck. It can easily rescue you from a horrible opening hand. If you can stay asleep just once early in the game during the opponent’s turn, the game is in good shape. It is also your free retreater after a knock out.

Floatzel: It is your energy accelerator. Buizel is the basic form.

Magnezone Prime: This card is the focus of the deck. It is a draw engine by itself. It lets you draw until you have six cards in your hand. Its attack is also featured in this deck. It allows you to do 50 damage for each energy you send from your side of the field to the Lost Zone. It can OHKO virtually every Pokémon in the format. Magnemite and Magneton and the necessary lower forms.

Vileplume: This is the game turner. Its Poke-Body locks both players from using any Trainer-Items. Just think about all the trainers that are set to become popular: Rare Candy, Pokémon Communication, Junk Arm, Energy Retrieval, PlusPower, Potion, Defender, Switch, Pokémon Reversal (soon to be replaced with Pokémon Catcher), etc. Those are all useless.

It shuts down Reshiram decks from energy recovery. It kills Zekrom decks that rely on Super Scoop Up. It is not that hard to get out by turn 3 and sometimes by turn 2. That can really change a game. Oddish and Gloom are the necessary lower forms.

Interviewer’s Question: Is there to allow you to search out energy when needed.

Judge: One of my personal favorite cards. Judge is very disruptive. I just love it when my opponent is setting up their hand for next turn. You see that they get that critical card: Emboar, Blastoise, Vileplume, Machamp, etc. Then you just Judge it away. Paired with Magnetic Draw, you have a full hand with six new cards again. This card can single handily turn a game.

Pokémon Collector and Professor Elm’s New Training Method: These are the search cards in the deck. They operate under Trainer-Item lock.

Rare Candy: In the optimal situation you are only going to use two of these. One for your first Magnezone Prime and one for your Vileplume.

There is 18 energy in this list. That requires you to play extremely tight. One misplay can and likely will cost you the game. With the prevalence of Pokémon with over 100 HP, you will need to send three energy per turn to the Lost Zone.

There are a few possible alterations that could be made:
  1. The deck could use a little bit more energy. I often find myself running down on Lightning Energy. It might be worth it to take out one Rare Candy and the one Gloom to make room for two more Lightning Energy.
  2. The single Gloom could be taken out.
  3. You could drop the Trainer-Item lock altogether and add in two Shaymin and two Alomomola as a hard Donphan counter. I do not like this idea. I would rather “pound it out” with Donphan than give up the Trainer-Item Lock.

Matchups:

ReshiBoar or ReshiPhlosion: Even. This deck may go down and early prize, but it just tanks too hard with Magnezone Prime. However, the single knock out with the non-Ability Emboar could even the match for ReshiBoar or the energy discard from Typhlosoin could set Magnezone back just enough to make a difference.

Zekrom: Favorable. If you can survive early donk, you will win this game. Zekrom is focused around its trainers. The Vileplume will wreck it.

Donphan: Even/Slightly Unfavorable. The weakness hurts and without Sunyshore City Gym there is not a hard counter. You can however use Floatzel as a backup attacker to hit Donphan for weakness.

Blastoise/Floatzel: Highly Favorable. If you can avoid the early snipes, its GG.

LostGar: Even. This deck runs a lot of Pokémon. LostGar will likely get the one per turn. However, they will need to keep the wave of attackers in order. You will OHKO everything in their deck.

Well, I hope that you all at least consider these two decks. I think that they could see some play. If Reshiram based decks see play, there will be a place for Blastoise based decks.

In my opinion, Magnezone Prime/Floatzel is just a bit faster than MagneBoar, MagneGatr, or MagnePhlosion. Thus, it can attack faster. Its water partner can even be uses as a secondary attacker against two of the more feared decks: Reshiram and Donphan.

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  • Derek Coontz

    I honestly just ran this deck at Battle Roads.. Thought I had found my own neat little deck. >.<

    • Anonymous

      Sorry man. Haha. Well I think it’s got a shot next format

    • Anonymous

      Sorry man. Haha. Well I think it’s got a shot next format

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_NLL7SUKV23EJIQZLAO3LPB2IDQ Flare Starfire

    I’ve been gathering the cards for Floatzel on the side.  It looks pretty viable to me, and it certainly should be tested by the UG testers, I think.

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_NLL7SUKV23EJIQZLAO3LPB2IDQ Flare Starfire

    I’ve been gathering the cards for Floatzel on the side.  It looks pretty viable to me, and it certainly should be tested by the UG testers, I think.

  • Anonymous

    I’ve been trying out out Magnezone/Feraligatr, and have been thinking about using Floatzel instead of Feraligatr. But since you’re already running so many Rare Candies, I think the Feraligatr route is better. Magnezone just runs through its deck so fast if you can attach as many Water as you need, and Feraligatr does better against Donphan in my opinion. Takes a little more Energy, but can KO a little easier (if they have 10 on them, you don’t need PlusPower), and can survive two Earthquakes. If you’re not worried about Donphan, then there’s almost no reason not to use Emboar instead.

    Blastoise/Floatzel is a boss deck, much better than Blastoise/Feraligatr. I know that sounds a little contradictory with above, but Magnezone speeds up itself whereas Blastoise has no draw engine other than Cleffa, and in addition he doesn’t benefit as much from being able to attach unlimited Energy per turn. Having field control with 100 damage snipes is great. Not the greatest at slugging out things one on one with other heavy hitters though, due to requiring at least one Floatzel to keep attacking, and only doing 100 damage for 4 Energy.

  • Anonymous

    ReshiBoar or ReshiPhlosion: Highly Favorable.-I don’t see how this is highly favorable. RDL has become a staple, and gurantees them more or less an easy 4 prizes, and two KO’s. Meaning all Reshiram has to grab is 2. I just don’t see how this is highly favorable. Maybe you can hit emboar for the 2HKO, but you’re having to deal with losing two blastoise to get there. I don’t see how you could argue that.

    You could hit the ninetails which would hurt, but then they’re in the same boat as you for draw, except you once again lost 2 blastoise. Also any deck with zoroark basically means you lose, GG bro. The ability to snipe floatzel kills blastoise so hard it’s not even funny. With the whole donphan thing, I have to go against you on this one. Donphan can take a hit back, hariyama cannot. It doesn’t matter that Hariyama can hit for more with two rainbow energies, next turn he’s going to be OHKO’d, and all of those resources will go to waste. If you’re that worried run some PlusPower. Hariyama isn’t bad, but there’s definitely better choices. Also I should have mentioned this earlier, but Cinccino is commonly paired with Zoroark, so if you end up fighting it I’d say there’s a high probability you’re going to lose as once again, Zoroark is what keeps this deck from being really competitive in my opinion.

    Finally, looking at the Magnezone/VilePlume/Floatzel list, I haven’t played it, but I would like to point out a couple of things. The first, is that 2 stage two lines without much trainer support seems a tad slow. I don’t know why twins isn’t included in the list. Secondly, I wonder how you’ll do on your energy count late game. It seems to me that you could easily run low as the game progresses (this is a common problem for any deck that relies on magnezone as a primary attacker). Other than that it seems like it could be fairly solid once it sets up, I guess it’s just taking the time to allow it to get there.

    • Anonymous

      Since when has RDL been a staple in ReshiBoar?

      • Anonymous

        its an alright tech but i prefer to build mine to set up as fast as possible, teching out two spots does hurt too much though.

    • Anonymous

      RDL:
      I see what you are saying, but man just try it first. The ReshiBoar list I tested against did have RDL in it. That does not matter a ton. With the reversals (which with Cleffa and PONT you actually get to pretty fast) you easily controll the board. A single heads and Emboar gets OHKO’d and when Catcher comes out, it is a guaranteed OHKO. Then it’s going to take 3 turns to set up RDL. Have fun doing that while I take 3 prizes. Ninetales is one shot everytime for easy prizes. Trust me if played properly it is a very favorable match up. It is a fast deck too, it usually starts sniping by turn 3.

      As for Donphan:
      - Yes it can survive Zekrom, but a good Magnezone will OHKO it anyway. And you will not have taken a prize with your tech. I’ll take the guarenteed prize everytime.
      -It is also cheaper than Donphan. One of the best things about Blastoise/Floatzel is that it is CHEAP. Why not give players an option to stay on the cheap side? Donphan is expensive.
      - Also, since it gets the OHKO virtually everytime you put pressure on their resources. Donphan allows them to safe resources and get them out of harms way.
      -Securing OHKO’s with you tech is vital, and Donphan fails more often.

      As for Zoroark:
      -It is definatelt not GG. It takes two turns to set up Zoroark. Snipe it. Problem solved.
      -If they set up Two at the same time, you snipe one. They take one of you Floatzel and you kill their second Zoroark (the common amount used for teching purposes) Then you still have 2 Floatzel to work with. Problem solved.
      -Being paired with Cinccino isn’t huge either. You can easily KO two before Cinccino KO’s you, and you are thinning their bench and reducing their bench.

      This deck is pretty good. I’ve play tested it a lot. It stands up pretty well, especially, if you get Blastoise up first.

      Magnezone List:
      1) It normally does not take past turn 3/4 to have a Magnezone and Vileplume set up. I’m not sure that you fully grasp how fast the Cleffa/PONT combo is. You can easily play through five six-card hands by turn 3. That is a lot of cards to work with.
      2)Twins could go in there, just not real sure what to take out.
      3) Your “2 stage two lins without mch trainer supportseems a tad slow” comment actually helps the argument for this deck. Everyone is using mad amounts of trainer support for setting up. If you set up just one Vileplume early, the game is in the bag. You’ve crippled so many decks it’s not even funny. Best part is that this deck is pretty quick (by next format’s standards) on its own. So, crippling other decks’ ability to set up or recover, while leaving yours intact, is a big advantage.

      • Anonymous

        Wow…. First off, you’re NOT faster than ReshiBoar… I don’t even know how you could argue that. ReshiBoar, assuming you HAVE to have ninetails out (which you don’t), ReshiBoar needs a Basic, a Stage 1, and a Stage 2. Blastzel needs two stage 1′s, one stage 2, and doesn’t have the draw support that ReshiBoar does. Secondly, you run three reversal. Which means you’re probably flipping one early game if you’re lucky, and that’s a 50/50. I’m not saying ReshiBoar has a favorable match-up, weakness really hurts, but you’re ignoring allot of key factors.

        1. Blastoise’s 130 HP. All they need is a Reshiram and a PlusPower, and since they’re built for that 130HP mark, it’s not that hard. Good luck swarming stage 2′s… 2. Once again, ReshiBoar is more consistent, if they aren’t running RDL, odds are they have key reversals of their own. Putting you in a very similar situation. 3. You have to choose between reversals, and a tech against zekrom. Seriously, if you don’t run donphan, or something it’s an autoloss.

        On Donphan:

        Rather or not it’ll survive Magnezone, it’s at least burning more resources (needing 3 energy, instead of 2). Additionally, I don’t know why you ignored my comment on PlusPower. PlusPower is an amazing card, and will help vs. Yanmega, or anything else out there that has the 110HP mark anyways. It’s really not that hard to throw a couple in, and it’s just an all around good card to have. I’d rather have to use one energy and a pluspower than 4 energy (2 of 4 rainbows to get the OHKO you say donphan can’t get), and guarantee losing my stage 1 the next turn. I’ll give you it’s cheaper, but arguing it’s better because of that is a different story. Blaziken wasn’t better than luxray, but it definitely was a cheaper alternative.

        On Zoroark:

        Are you serious? Oh yeah, snipe it because I’ll definitely get a blastoise with 4 energy, before they can get a stage 1 with two energy… Snipe it. xD Seriously man? I’m sorry but you really have to be overhyping this if you think you can get your set-up before they can get a zoroark… Not to mention ZoroCino runs 4 reversals, and probably at least 3 junk arms. Seriously man, it’s not a good match-up. They’re faster, even if their damage output is a tad low.

        On Magnezone:

        You must have better luck than me on PONT/Cleffa. I’ve used, and abused the engine, love it, but it’s all to easy to shuffle into a couple of bad hands to ruin your day. I’ve played around with VilePlume, and it is really good, but running two stage two’s in this format is very… Slow…

      • Anonymous

        Last reply because I’m not going to argue with you all day.

        1) I never said that Donphan was bad. I also never said that Hariyama was better outright. I’m merely saying that it is not as one sided as you are making it out to be. It is important to get OHKO’s with techs. That single damage counter that gets put on your bench is also bad in so many ways.

        2) I never said it was faster than Reshiram. It certainly is not slower (or at least not much). ReshiBoar relies on a Stage 1 and a Stage 2 to be up and running plus at least 3 energy. With 4 Collector (little over 40% chance to have in open hand), 4 Cleffa, 4 Communication, 3 PETM, and 3 PONT it is not hard to get out a Blastoise by turn 2/3 with four energy (one being a DCE). It can definately hang with ReshiBoar in early game set up speed. It might be slower to recover, but not nessicarily to set up.

      • Anonymous

        Wow? You win worlds lately, or are you just that full of yourself? Getting on the front page of sixprizes doesn’t make you the best player in the world so don’t flatter yourself too much, and insult me for no apparent reason. You’re just mad because someone had the guts to point out the weakness that you failed to put in your article. Everytime I work on a deck I make sure to note its strengths, and weakness, all you manage to do is hype. Just because you say “last reply” doesn’t make you right.

        1.)Once again, with Donphan, it’s just in generally a better card. I already agreed with you on pricing, but that isn’t the issue here. Hariyama require FOUR energy, two of which need to be Rainbow energy. When Hariyama dies you’re losing ALLOT of resources. A stage 1 with 4 energy is a good amount of resources for pretty much any deck. While I’ll admit the other Donphan could work, I’d rather have a guranteed 120, possible 140, than a possible 0, and once again more attachments. Also if Zekrom attacks then it will have 40 on it, and it’s irrelevant (here’s where I proceed to accuse you of theorymon because you never mentioned that before just like you accused me of using theorymon with no basis to your statement like the arrogant person you are).

        2.)ReshiBoar doesn’t HAVE to have Ninetails to start attacking that’s an incorrect statement. You were clearly implying that Blastzel was faster when you were talking about using reversal on emboar before it got set up. I’ve play tested both decks, and ReshiBoar is more consistent. It has draw power, better energy acceleration, and allot of solid match-ups. ONCE AGAIN, I’ll say that ReshiBoar will probably lose to Blastzel, but that doesn’t mean you can write it off as a instant win the way you did. I was just pointing out the harder aspects of the match-up, and you managed to blow it up into this.

        3.)Once again, Cinccino/Zoroark has an advantage of Blastzel. The run reversal which you claim makes your match-up with ReshiBoar infallible. A good list has no problem picking up early prizes, getting the lead and putting you down. The reason I made the point with Zoroark was because you need at least two floatzel to keep up with the prize exchange. Have you ever tested the match-up, or are you just applying theorymon? 3 PlusPowers every now and then isn’t asking for much (with junk arms), and once you lose one Blastoise you’ll have trouble keeping up, especially since Cinccino is likely to take the early game prize lead. I love how you cutting off another deck’s support makes them auto-lose, but you’re fine if your entire bench is dead…

        4.)Once again, PlusPower means dedicating less resources than 4 energy to something that’s guaranteed to be return KO’d. Donphan probably won’t be returned KO’d unless they use magnezone, takes less energy, does the job fine to kill zekroms. Once again, the other donphan is fine, but need more energy, and is flippy, something which 99% of competitive players avoid if they can.

        5.)I don’t like MagenBoar either. I’m not saying it can’t set up, but at least in magneboar you have access to other resources like comm. Not to say either of those decks are bad, just that they’re a bit slow, and that could cost them the game. The more lines in the deck, the clunkier, and less consistent you’re going to be. That’s a fact.

        Finally, I never put any words in your mouth. You were assuming that you would set up before emboar, and reversal the emboar away first chance you got. Then you’re opponent is left attaching to the rest of the field. Well if that’s not claiming your faster I don’t know what is. Once Emboar hits the field, it’s easy to set up at least two reshirams, which is going to be two KO’d blastoises. Saying I was going to have to attach for turns is saying that I wouldn’t have anything set up other than that one emboar. That’d be like me saying “I’ll donk you with steelix”, and then later claiming I never said I would set up faster. What did you want me to believe? Seriously?

        For everything else, I’ve already responded in the above, and you felt repeating yourself at the bottom of your post, and taking a personal jab at me was necessary to prove your point. I’ve tested Blastzel, it’s not bad, I just wanted to point out the weakness from my testing. If you have a problem with someone doing that, then maybe you shouldn’t post your list on the internet. Then know one would tell you the flaws. =3

      • Anonymous

        OK so I lied, that was not my last post.

        1) I never said that it was an auto-win. I said “highly favorable.” If I meant auto-win I would say auto-win. It is similar to saying that Gyarados is Highly Favorable to Charizard. Charizard can win, but not likely.

        2) I never said it was faster. You don’t have to set up before Emboar to Pokemon Reversal it and then OHKO it. Then it will be hard to set up RDL in one turn. It is not the same as saying that Blastoise is outright faster than Reshiram/Emboar. I also never, ever said that Ninetales is needed to attack, but it is highly important to recovery and keeping the deck going.

        3) Talk to almost anyone I know, I am anything but arrogant. I will call out people for miss-using what I say. There are things that you infered that I never said.

        4) I do not mind people critiqing my decklist. However, I do have the right to offer counter points to the critique. Then you escalated it with undeserved vigor. Language such as “Wow…. First off, you’re NOT faster than ReshiBoar… I don’t even know how you could argue that.” and “Also any deck with zoroark basically means you lose, GG bro.” and “Are you serious? Oh yeah, snipe it because I’ll definitely get a blastoise with 4 energy, before they can get a stage 1 with two energy… Snipe it. xD Seriously man?”

        5) I never said that I was great or implied that I think I’m great. The World’s comment was ridiculous.

        6) I also never directly attacked your person. I never called you arrogant, or a punk, etc. I simply (albeit sharply) critiqued your post and your argument and the “evidence” that you used.

        If you would like to continue this, PM me. I would be glad to continue this debate on what works well. This is not the appropriate forum for this conversation to continue on.

      • Anonymous

        1.)You had donphan as favorable, a match-up that should more or less be an autowin for any decent water deck. Then you had ReshiBoar as highly favorable. What’d you want me to think?

        2.)I’m not even going to keep arguing this point as it seems to be getting nowhere. You’re comment was seriously implying that to me, but if you didn’t mean it that way it’s the internet, emotions don’t transfer through writing like they do in real life.

        3.)You sound that way to me, as every single card I bring up that could possibly beat blastoise you immediately claim could never work, and go on to tell me how the deck is infallible to anything, but your other newest creation. You’ve got enough tech room for everything after all.

        4.)I love how you point out all my comments on Zoroark, which is a match-up I’ve tested, and one which is clear you have not.

        5.)Maybe you shouldn’t go insulting people then?

        6.)You accused me of theroymoning, which I haven’t done. I admitted with the Vileplume build I had doubts, but was strait forward with not having tested it yet. It really makes me mad when people fall back on “you’re theorymoning” when I’m providing valid testing results.

        7.)You can take it to PM if you want, I’m confident enough in my stance to leave it in the public. Sorry to burst your bubble, blastoise is a good deck, but I’m not sure it’s as unstoppable as you claim it to be.

  • Anonymous

    Wow!! I really like what you did with the Blastoise/Flotzel deck. That Haryama isn’t a bad idea. you actually save your self from being KO’ed by Reshiram just by adding him over Donphan Prime. I’ve been testing this with Domphan for the most part. It’s not bad, but that damage is crucial. I’ve really got to try haryama in this. If I win with this next season I’ll be sure to mention you for that tech. :)

    I like the other deck as well. That vileplume is gonna wreck everything in the format. I’m actually scared if this takes off. Nice job. :)

  • Anonymous

    typo:

    ba ck on the pokemon Reversal part. other than that, pretty good article!

    • Anonymous

      Thanks

  • Anonymous

    Have you thought of running throh instead of haryama? It’s a basic doing 80 for 1 less energy. Same hp, retreat cost, and weakness. Being that the list doesn’t include any plus power, you would have to 2HKO a zekrom or magnezone with haryama’s first attack anyway and the extra 20 damage from his second attack isn’t needed if you’re hitting for 160 with weakness.

    • Anonymous

      Thanks a lot man. That actually sounds like a great idea. I guess I just did not look through the B&W set enough. I really like it, thanks again for pointing that out.

  • Anonymous

    Good idea dude.
    It was even better when it was a Battle Starter Deck in Japan.

    http://pokebeach.com/tcg/battle-starter-decks

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_XEXG74FIFSEULXSCCUA735ONTQ David Brooks

    Good article man my girlfriend is thinkin about using a blastoise/floatzel deck its is just to bad they rotated out octillery man he would go good in there well actually he went good in just about any deck that ran on energizers and tankers he was just a perfect tech but good article man!!!

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_MDFBEX2BW2W7GAEWAVU5B2DVFY Lee

    I am well aware you mention NOT taking unreleased cards like Beartic into account, however, I would just like to note that a Beartic mixed around with cards from this deck makes one devastating combo from what my testing has shown so far. It simply covers your tracks on the decks you list as unfavorable or highly unfavorable and makes this mean deck a blast to play (yes, pun intended).

  • Anonymous

    Great decks

    List 1: You don’t really need the pokemon reversal cause blastoise snipes, its still a flippy card, and you dont need 4 switch cause floatzel and cleffa have free retreat, maybe 2 if its your blastoise, or a sleeping cleffa but thats some bad luck.

    List 2: I like the Hariyama in your deck, it’ll throw people off, and if they ask *why not run donphan prime?* Tell them: Buy me one. Lol.

    List 3: Instead of floatzel, have you tried pachirisu for extra energy attachment for lost burn? yea you might have to run seeker and super scoop up but the buizels and floatzel will be taken out and all your water energies can be lightning, but i really like the floatzel just was curious if you tried it thats all.

    What you think about stantler with call for family, it has a built in collector, but it puts basics in your bench,that way you don’t have to worry about your opponent judging what cleffa gave you and you can use another supporter instead of collector. Great idea with running judges with all those reshiboars out there, that’ll make them draw hardly any cards before they can put out a emboar or ninetales.

    • Anonymous

      Thanks!

      1) I have actually found Switch and Pokemon Reversal to be good cards in this deck. I have often been stuck early game with a sleeping Cleffa. The switch gives me a sure fire way to wake it up and use it again. Pokemon Reversal (albeit flippy) helps out a lot. It allows me to OHKO those pesky bench sitters that I could otherwise not. Emboar is the main one. You can get it active and OHKO it. Then they have a harder time with powering up RDL or Magnezone.

      If taken out, what cards would you suggest putting in? I would like to do some more testing with slightly different lists.

      2) Yeah, I just don’t have the Donphan Primes… haha

      3) I did try this deck with Pachirisu. It was OK, but I preferred the more consistant Floatzel. Floatzel gives you free retreater for after KOs. I really think that it comes down to player preference on this one.

      I have gone back and forth on Stantler/Minun versus Cleffa as a starter. I just found that Cleffa is more suitable for me. When I was playing Stantler, yes I could put basics on my bench, but too often was the rest of my hand dead. So, the next turn I could not really do much with those basics I just got. Maybe if I tightened up the list a bit more Stantler would be the way to go. Also, Cleffa has been handy late game once or twice. It has saved me from a bad hand and then gotten lucky and stayed asleep during my opponent’s turns. Again, I think this comes down to playstyle.

      • Anonymous

        List 1: I understand the reversal more now, the switch as well. Taking out like 2 switches for junk-arms would ensure you to have a switch later late game or reversal, since your running junipers, if you do put in junk arms that means you can run 2-3 rare candies and give you more room so like:
        -2 switch
        -1 or 2 rare candy
        -1 pokemon reversal (if you want)
        +2-4 junk arms so you can add more juniper if you like her.

        Also about pokemon collector, Dual ball is actually pretty sweet, its also flippy but your bound to get 1 heads and if you run them instead of collectors you still have your supporter for the turn. Also Dual ball works great with Junk-arm to re-use again. Its worth testing. (3-4 dual balls)

        List 2: Theres always marowak, for 2 DCE flip 2 coins for each heads he does 60, so you can take out the rainbows for water.

        List 3: You can run the plusle that lets you draw 2 cards that way you don’t have to reset your hand to 6 and keep what you like. If you already have minun, u could try 2 minun and 2 plusle. Minun second attack does 30 if plusle is in your bench which is pretty nice, (especially on the first turn against a water deck or a starting cleffa)

        Or try 2 stantler, 2 cleffa. 

      • Anonymous

        Thanks for the tips.

        I like the idea of reducing the Switch and increasing using Junk Arm. I don’t mind Juniper, but I’m not really feeling it like some other (extremely well respected) players. I also might give Dual Ball a try.

        The thing about Marowak, is that it is not a guaranteed OHKO on Zekrom or Magnezone. Those DCE are vital to keeping Blastoise rolling and I would prefer not to use them on anything else. However, someone did mention using Thorh from Black and White, and I think that is an excellent idea. It will open up two spaces.

        I’m not too sold on the simple “draw x cards” starting Pokemon. I think that is a big risk of still not having anything productive come from your starter. I would probably go straight 4 Cleffa or straight 4 Stantler (or Minun because it does the same thing as Stantler).

      • Anonymous

        No problem. 

        Thats fine, marowak was just something that came to me, since he’s just a colorless attacker, and uses less energy than hariyama, and yea throh looks like a better choice.

        Draw 2 is pretty small, i only mentioned it, cause its a nice boost to minun attacks and it has a bit more hp than cleffa. Stanler or minun the only difference is really the HP, which is 10 difference. 

  • aura

    I like the Floatzel/Magnezone/Vileplume, but with one attacker with one attack that LZs energies, it seems like another attacker or more energies would be necessary. Could Lanturn work as an attacker to take maybe 1-3 prizes before sending up Magnezone?