Bet on the Spread?

So, the Noble Victories set has arrived. The scans are up and we have cards in hand. However, they are not legal until post-Regionals. Nevertheless, this is Pokémon and we have the patience of two year olds when it comes to predicting new decks. Well today, I am going to look at an overall deck type and what options we have to play it. Of course, we are going to look at the Spread Decks.

Obviously, there are two main spreading­­­­­­ Pokémon that we are going to look at today: Tyranitar and Kyurem. Let’s start with the elder of the two cards.

T-Tar

Tyranitar has excited a lot of players since its release in the Unleashed set. The Pokémon is a Stage 2 Dark Type with 160 HP. It is weak to Fighting and resists Psychic. T-Tar also has a hefty three retreat cost. Its first attack for a single Darkness energy does 20 damage to every Pokémon in play, except other Darkness type Pokémon. This is the bread and butter of any deck that uses T-Tar, but it does have two more attacks. For DCC you can do 60 damage and for DDCC you do 120 and discard the top three cards of your deck.

The idea behind T-Tar is to get a quick T-Tar to hit a couple Darkness Howls and do at least 20 (30 to the active if using SP Darkness Energy) to everything on the board. Let’s take a look at a very skeletal list:

Pokemon – 11

4 Larvitar UL
2 Pupitar UL
4 Tyranitar Prime UL
1 Cleffa HS/CL

Trainers – 20/22

4 Pokémon Collector
4 Pokémon Communication
4 Rare Candy
8-10 Draw/Refresh Cards (PONT, Juniper, Twins, Sage’s, Cheren, etc.)

Energy – 8

4 Special Darkness
4 Basic Darkness

That is what every single T-Tar based decks needs as its backbone.  This leaves us with 19 spaces to play around with. So, what type of cards could T-Tar possible utilize? Consider the following:

Tyranitar Prime

Jirachi UL: This is the quintessential finisher in a the spread archetype. This baby can score two or three KOs in a single turn with Time Hollow and the damage amassed on your opponent’s board from Darkness Howl.

Max Potion: This card can turn T-Tar into a great tank because of the low energy costs. You can easily discard one energy to heal a lot of damage and then play down another energy.

Darkrai & Cresselia Legend: This bad boy can also score you a couple KOs in a single turn with Moon’s Invite by arranging the damage on your opponent’s field.

Zoroark BLW: This card has the type compatibility with T-Tar and can serve as an alternative attacker to take care of big threats.

Weavile UD: This is another card that is type compatible with T-Tar that can serve as an alternative attack and can disrupt your opponent’s hand with Claw Snag.

Lunatone TM + Solrock TM: These two cards paired together make it impossible for your opponent to remove damage from their side of the field.

Problems

OK, let’s stop there with the T-Tar discussion. I hope that it gave you an insight into the basic workings of T-Tar, but there are obvious reasons why T-Tar has not become a mainstay in last format’s meta and in this format’s meta. Let’s talk about those reasons:

1. Tyranitar is not compatible with its own Basic and Stage 1. Larvitar and Pupitar are both Fighting Pokémon. This means that when you use Darkness Howl, both of these Pokémon will take 20-30 damage. This is a huge problem because when they do become T-Tars they will be in OHKO range with a simple single or double PlusPower drop by the two best decks in the format: tyRam and ZPST.

2. T-Tar is a Stage 2 Pokémon. Spread decks need to be fast and need to start spreading on turn two. If they can accomplish that, it will only take four or five more turns to deal 80-150 damage to everything on the field (enough to OHKO almost everything), and win the game. However, because T-Tar is a Stage 2, this rarely happens. Also, when you do get it off, T-Tar will eventually die and then it is hard to stream more Tyranitars.

3. There are too many healing options in the format right now. You have Max Potion + Junk Arm, Serperior, Potion, and Blissey. You also have preventative cards like Defender and soon to be Eviolite. This prevents the strategy from taking full effect. Yes, you can use Lunatone and Solrock to prevent healing, but they are Fighting Types that will be KO’d by two or three Darkness Howls (less than it takes to KO the other players Pokémon).

4. The Fighting Weakness is a big downer in this format and last format. Last format you had Speed Champ with take out to counter the SP decks and Machamp Prime to take down T-Tar with Champ Buster. This year you still have Machamp Prime, but the real problem Donphan Prime’s usage. Donphan can OHKO T-Tar with Heavy Impact.

So, in general, T-Tar is an amazingly fun deck to play, but faces too many challenges in the meta to succeed.

Kyurem v. T-tar

Well, that leaves us with the other spread option: Kyurem.

Now, Kyurem has been one of the most hyped cards in the Noble Victories set (along with N and Victini). It is the third elemental dragon, and just like the other two, it has 130 HP and is a basic. Kyurem has the same Outrage attack as its counter parts, a double retreat cost, and a weakness to Metal Pokémon (a great weakness at the moment, but if Kyurem becomes popular, runs down Reshiram’s playability, there are PLENTY of Metal Pokémon just waiting to be picked back up.)

However, Kyurem’s second attack does 30 damage to each of your opponent’s Pokémon for two Water Energy and a Colorless.

So, is this Pokémon going to be able to succeed where T-Tar has failed? Let’s take a look at T-Tar’s weaknesses and see it Kyurem can fix the problems:

1. Compatibility: Well, given as how it is a basic and only does damage to your opponent’s side of the field, this appears to be a great solution to the compatibility problem that T-Tar suffers.

2. Speed: Kyurem is a basic Pokémon, making it very streamable. However, its attack costs three energy. This means that to be successful you will need an energy accelerator (or slow the opponent down). What can do the trick? The obvious candidate is Feraligatr Prime. This card is an Emboar for Water Types. However, it is a Stage 2 Pokémon and is subject to the same slowness as T-Tar.

You could play Floatzel to get energy onto the field and then use Shaymin, Energy Switch, or Blastoise to move it over. This is beginning to look more promising. You can easily get a Kyurem onto the field with Floatzel early then use Shaymin to start spreading on turn two.

Then you can start building Blastoise to facilitate energy transfer the rest of the game and be used as a finisher. It would seem that Kyurem has options to run faster than Tyranitar.

3. Healing options: Well there are still a lot of healing options in the format. So, this can be a big problem. However, Kyurem does not inflict damage on Lunatone or Solrock. You could play those two cards, but they would be easy Catcher Prizes.

4. Weakness: Kyurem is weak to Metal Pokémon. This is a great weakness to have considering how few Metal Pokémon there are in the current meta, because of Reshiram. So, for now this is a safe play, but if Kyurem and Beartic see more play, Scizor, Steelix, and Cobalion could see more play.

Now, obviously, Kyurem is a much more viable  candidate for utilizing the spread strategy than T-Tar. So, let’s dig into some skeletal lists.

kyGatr

Pokemon - 

4 Totodile HS
2 Croconaw HS/CL
3 Feraligatr Prime
4 Kyurem NV
1 Cleffa HS/CL
1 Lunatone TM
1 Solrock TM

Trainers - 

4 Pokémon Collector
4 Pokémon Communication
3 Rare Candy
1 Pokémon Catcher
3 Sage’s Training
2 Professor Juniper
2 Professor Oak’s New Theory
1 Pokegear 3.0
2 Twins
3 N
2 Switch
3 Junk Arm

Energy – 14

12 Water
2 Rescue

This is a fast and disruptive version of the kyGatr deck. The obvious purpose of this deck sot draw very quickly. Go down a few prizes and then use Twins and N. And stream Glaciate for most of the game.

This seems like a fairly straight forward approach to the deck and I’m sure it need refining. However, this deck has a couple of problems.

1. It is susceptible to Catcher disruption very easily. Feraligatr is a huge Catcher target and the two healing blockers are easy prizes.

2. It has no protection for Kyurem. Yes, Kyurem is a very bulky basic, but unfortunately, it is still just a PlusPower drop away from being OHKOd by Reshiram or Zekrom. Also, Feraligatr is only a double PlusPower drop from going down. So, all tyRam or Zekrom has to do is take out the big Gatr and then OHKO a couple Kyurems to cripple your strategy.

3. This deck has limited attacking options other than Glaciate. Feraligatr can do 80 for WWWW, but that is both slow and inefficient.

Now let’s move onto the Kyurem/Blastoise/Floatzel list:

Pokemon – 22

3 Squirtle UL
2 Wartortle UL
3 Blastoise UL
3 Buizel UL
3 Floatzel UL
4 Kyurem NV
1 Shaymin UL
1 Cleffa HS/CL

Trainers – 26

4 Pokémon Collector
4 Pokémon Communication
3 Rare Candy
2 N
3 Sage’s Training
2 Twins
4 Professor Oak’s New Theory
3 Junk Arm
1 Energy Switch

Energy – 14

11 Water

3 Double Colorless

This is again a relatively straight forward approach to the deck. This version trades a couple things with the kyGatr version.

1. There is no healing blockers. This deck just seems to be so tight (4 attacks, a Stage 2 support, and Stage 1 support) that you cannot get in Lunatone or Solrock. This could cause problems as players would be able to clear off the damage.

2. However, this deck does have a better finishing attack in Blastoise. For WWCC you can deal 100 damage to any Pokémon on your opponent’s side of the field. This will allow you to do a couple Glaciates and then finish of almost anything with Hydro Launcher.

3. Both decks are still vulnerable to OHKOs on Kyurem and the support Pokémon.

4. This deck requires a three Pokémon combo. So, while the initial attack might go off faster than kyGatr, the deck will require more maintenance to keep the stream going.

So, both of these decks seem to have promise, and problems. Both seem to have potential, but are they the best option for Kyurem?

VileBox

Let’s take a look at another form.

Pokemon – 21

3 Solosis BLW
1 Duosion BLW
2 Reuncilus BLW
3 Oddish UD
1 Gloom UD
2 Vileplume UD
1 Pichu HS
1 Cleffa HS/CL
3 Kyurem NV
2 Zekrom BLW
1 Lunatone TM
1 Solrock TM

Trainers – 26

4 Twins
3 N
3 Sage’s Training
4 Pokémon Collector
2 Pokémon Communication
2 Professor Elm’s Training Method
3 Rare Candy
3 Seeker
2 Black Belt

Energy – 13

3 Double Colorless
4 Rainbow
4 Water
2 Lightning

Vileplume UDNow, there is something personally appealing to me.

This is obviously the Ross.dec engine with the dragon attackers and N for better comeback ability. This deck really seems like a good place to be heading right now.

You can flood their field with damage. You can add damage to your side of the field with Bolt Strike and Rainbow Energy. You can utilize Outrage on the two dragons. You have healing in Dragons + Seeker. You can use DCE to retreat anything in the deck. You can use Black Belt so score a OHKO on things that really mess with this type of deck (Magnezone, Emboar, RDL). You have eliminated the threat to your healing blockers by eliminating Catcher from play.

This deck is obviously in a rough state, as are all these lists. However, they seem to have some potential in the meta game post-Regionals. Only time will tell.

Please comment below to get some discussion going on this great topic. I did not include matchups because I have logged games with these lists, but not nearly enough to be comfortable with putting them out there. Also, the meta game might shift dramatically with the NV set; so, predictions against bad lists or potentially bad decks is not what I want to put into an article.

I have a pretty extensive Regional Preview for you all. I will be submitting it early next week. It will look at the top decks in-depth, and give links and descriptions to other candidates as well. It also has general playing tips and some deck choice material. I just figured that this would be a little welcome break to the hardcore testing for Regionals.

  • Ross Gilbert

    “The idea behind T-Tar is to get a quick T-Tar to hit a couple Darkness Howls and do at least 20 (30 if using SP Darkness Energy) to everything on the board”

    Nice Article Dude but (concerning the quote above), Special Dark only affects the damage done to the active so it would do 30 to the active and 20 to the rest of the board. Sure you knew this and just a typo :)

    Also: You mention about Max Potion to heal Tyranitar then Solrock / Lunatone to stop your opponent healing. This will also stop you healing though, hence Max Potion will be useless and Tyranitar kinda loses its ability to tank….

    • Anonymous

      Yeah, that was a slip up on the SP Dark. Sorry about that.

      However, I stand by what I said about Max Potion and the Healing Blockers. I think you read into the article a bit. Let me explain:

      1) I never said that you have to play both. I merely mentioned both as techs in the deck. Both are at least somewhat viable.

      2) What I said about both cards individually is completely true. Max Potion makes T-Tar a solid tank and the Healing Blockers… block healing.

      3) Even if you do play both, you can be wise in your deployment of the cards. Consider: You get an early T-Tar and do spread damage. Then you get hit in the face for 120 by the dragons. Well, your next turn would be an excellent time to play Max Potion to keep T-Tar alive another turn. You play it. Then you spread against (40 damage on their whole bench, 60 active). They hit you against. You play it again (second copy, Junk Arm). You spread again (60 bench, 90 active). The hit you. You don’t play Max Potion and just spread (80 bench, 110 active). The KO you. You promote another T-Tar and NOW play down the blockers to lock that damage (possibly 510 total damage) on the field. This is a perfectly reasonable way to play both Max Potion and the Damage Blockers.

      They do not have to be mutually exclusive.

      I do check facts a lot. When I make mistakes, they tend to be just a slip up. I simply forgot to clarify the 30 active 20 to bench concept, and it was worded poorly.

      Thanks for the comment and the rating!

      • Anonymous

        I think you can cut 1 Kyurem for an Eviolite at least, just to have the option available. I do agree the lists are all very tight. 

        • Anonymous

          the problem with that is you want to start with Kyurem and Kyurem can be played under trainerlock.

      • Anonymous

        If you play Solrock Lunatone and Max Potion play Seeker/SSU.

        Seeker/SSU whichever one has been hit harder, Max Potion stuff, and then put it back down.

        It makes Max Potion 2 cards, but in TTar i’ll take it.

  • Anonymous

    Spread always sounds so cool, but there aren’t many likely options for it. Most of them require combinations of Pokemon and/or the spreading attacker is a Stage 2. Tyranitar Prime is (in my opinion) the most likely to work early because of its single Energy cost, but there’s the problem you addressed about it hurting Larvitar and Pupitar. (Not even mentioning Hydreigon and getting two DCE onto it to attack on the second turn….)

    I’m not the biggest fan of the Ross engine, but the Vilebox list looks neat. I wish the heal blocking could be used without having two Pokemon on your bench to tech into other decks though. Great way to block Off Max Potion and Blissey Prime.

    I’m glad we have an article that doesn’t guess at the match ups when they aren’t tested thoroughly enough. Great change, needs to be done more often.

  • Anonymous

    I’m personally pretty pumped for Kyurem due to it’s spread capabilities. If you’re main focus is to spread as much damage as possible, I think combining Kyurem with Feralgatr, Kingdra, and Rocky Helmet could be a decent way to maximize your damage output.  You spread 30 with Kyurem, add 10 more for each Kingdra, and have the additional 2 damage counters with rocky helmet, and you can really add some pressure onto your opponents side of the field.
    It just sucks that Feralgatr and Kingdra are both stage 2′s. Kind of slows the deck down. I really want to test this idea out, but unfortunately I don’t really have a lot of free time to do so :/

  • http://twitter.com/SansEuphemism Deric Tan

    You could add a few Dragons on the Tyranitar list to have a double function as outrage user and spreading the opponent out

  • Anonymous

    It seems to me the two non-Vilebox lists would do well to run Eviolite. Also, unless some unforeseen development is going to diminish Zekrom play, trying to use Floatzel/Blastoise as an energy acceleration combo seems fairly ill-fated. 

    Regarding the Vilebox list, once you have Vileplume in play, the Lunatone/Solrock combo are only blocking Blissey Prime, right? Seems it bit clunky both in terms of your set-up and late-game bench space, unless I’m missing something.

    Ultimately, Glaciate just does too little damage for too much energy to really be an effective archetype. I’m sure Kyurem will see plenty of play as a anti-Reshiram/Donphan tech, but as a primary attacker, I think it may be worse than T-tar.

    • Anonymous

      Personally, I do not think that Kyurem will be Tier 1 as the frontliner of a deck. I agree that it’s damage output is too low for too high of a cost.

      The Blastzel list, I guess is more of a BlastZel deck with a Kyurem starter to soften up the bench. I absolutely agree that it struggles against ZPST, but it’s other match ups are not terrible.

      However, just because a deck is not tier 1 does not mean that it can’t have an article :)

      • Anonymous

        I think 180 for three energy compatable with Feraligatr is a pretty good damage output.

        • Anonymous

          Yeah, but because that 180 is spread out it is manageable with stuff like Max Potion, Serperior, Blissey, etc. unless you play with the healing blockers. However, those blockers are Catcher bait and your opponent will likely be able to take a prize a turn or so.

        • Anonymous

          First of all, Serperior isn’t widely played. It’s a good card, but it isn’t great. The format isn’t the best for it either, where stage 2s have to be mandatory to play to be played.

          Max Potion can’t be played under trainerlock.

          Blissey would wipe out all the energy on your opponent’s field unless your opponent used Reuniclus.

  • Anonymous

    Eviolite deserves more of a mention than not at all, it keeps Kyurem alive for longer.

    • Anonymous

      I hear ya, but I left it out for a couple reasons:

      1) The lists are fairly tight. Most lists are pretty tight right now. That’s why I’m not too sure of Eviolite’s place in the meta outside of ZPST. ZPST already runs some defenders and has more flexibility in list structure than other decks. The problem with Kyurem and Reshiram is that there are hefty support Pokemon that need set up. This take a lot of deck space. This limits the options when running cards like Eviolite.

      2) Because there are bound to be set up Pokemon in any Kyurem deck (execpt maybe Electrode versions), Eviolite is too eadily played around with Pokemon Catcher. So what if it take another turn to KO Kyurem with an Eviolite because I will simply take out your support, you will not be able to attach energy fast enough, and I will that the KO over two turns. No big deal.

      In general, I think people are overreacting a bit to Eviolite. It is just to easy to get around and too few decks have the list space/ right Pokemon to take full advantage.

  • Anonymous

    Good point. :)

  • Anonymous

    I like that combo, but it seems to be way to slow. The spread had to be fast to keep up.

    This was supposed to be in response to Pokedex

  • barryfken

    Vilebox seems scary, lol.

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_YKW66HHHNNYAPF4Q44XYCG4CBA Jared

    Great article on an awesome card, however I have to say that I don’t see the ross style deck, or any others like it, working out anymore. I think kyurem (assuming it does get popular) will kill the ross engine. First of all, solosis has 30 hp so as soon as a loaded kyurem hits the field all of your solosis are dead. This means the ross deck will rely on going first and having either duosion or reuniclus out turn two. If kyurem goes first and is loaded turn two you won’t have a reuniclus out in the game which defeats the purpose of the deck. Also, the ross build relies heavily on twins, which kyurem won’t activate until its most likely too late.

    • Anonymous

      I get what you are saying. I just think that Kyurem is rather limited by itself in the meta. I might be mistaken, but I think this will be a played cards, but not extremely widespread. So, Ross will be ok. Also, you have to remember that Kyurem will require energy acceleration to get going. This will slow it down and likely give you two or three turns to get those basics to at least the stage 1 evolution.

      • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_YKW66HHHNNYAPF4Q44XYCG4CBA Jared

        Even so, I think it will be an extremely tough matchup for the Ross. It will put a lot of pressure on the ross player and I don’t see it being too terribly difficult to get a kyurem up and running turn two. I hope you are right though because Ross variants are my favorite at the moment and I love how creative players get with them. Also, though I’m not sure they are the best techs for kyurem, lunatone and solrock blocking blissey drops kill another very important aspect of the Ross and it becomes dependent on seekers to remove damage off of the board.

        • Anonymous

          Yeah, the Lunatone/Solrock would only need to be dropped later in the game. Also, in a Kyurem based ross deck, Seeker + Dragon would be the better healing option.

          I am hard pressed to see how Kyurem would be a turn two Glaciate off more than 50-60% of the time, it is just too reliant on other energy accelerators.

        • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_YKW66HHHNNYAPF4Q44XYCG4CBA Jared

          60% was pretty much the percentage I had in mind. So (again, assuming the deck gets big) the Ross player will either lose all of their solosis or use all of their resources to get their evolutions out. At that point their entire setup will have probably 60 damage on it without the ability to heal any of it off. I still think Ross loses this matchup 95% of the time. Maybe more. Especially without the ability to catcher out gatrs

        • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_YKW66HHHNNYAPF4Q44XYCG4CBA Jared

          Of course this is all major theorymon, but that’s how i see it playing out.

  • Anonymous

    Well, the Ross-variant doesn’t boast any way of speeding up the energy-attachments, thus making it reliant a pretty rapidly setup lock. And you can’t really do anything against Magnezone, who’ll simply wait on the bench until it has enough energy to take down Kyurem – a kill to which you’ll have no immediate response, considering you’ll have to attach manually three times pr. kyurem…

    • Anonymous

      This is the way that the current Ross deck works… it’s just kinda the nature of the beast. The hope is that you can put 120 damage on a benched Zekrom and then OHKO that Magnezone and lock them out of the remaining Magnezones. That’s just the nature of the beast

  • http://www.teamomar.com/ Ed

    “This card is an Emboar for Water Types.”
    Is that like saying that telephones are cell phones for houses?
    The radio (or CD player) is the iPod for cars?
    Cash is the credit card for paper lovers?
    Analog is the digital for old folks?
    Magic is the Pokemon for geeks?

    • Anonymous

      Emboar is a better type and can utilize Shuckle.

    • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_CJP7G2XYQ364NJRBOPCCDITBVY Connor

      Anyone playing Pokemon is also a geek. Yes I’m a geek.

  • Anonymous

    I thought that Kyurem wasn’t legal until after Regionals.

    But the picture at the beginning was funny.

  • Anonymous

    It is not legal until after Regionals. I just figured a change of pace article would be appreciated. I will be back with a BIG Regional preview soon.

  • Anonymous

    Yes, Emboar is hands down better for eveything but Water.

    As for Shuckle, I think it is pretty well established that this is now more of a gimmick draw engine now.

    Sorry, I have no idea what glitch is going on… this was supposed to be in reply to coolestman22

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_MDFBEX2BW2W7GAEWAVU5B2DVFY Lee

    Glad you mention DCL in there… to me this is a sort of must-have tech in any spread deck, even if its just 1-1. Granted I have only recently started testing with Kuyrem/DCL and it most certainly is clunky right now, but my goodness, when you purposely alter play style to not bother with exact KOing stuff (getting easier and easier now with such high HPs) and bring out DCL mid-late game and attach just one Psychic or Rainbow energy, it can be total game changer. A few games I got two or three prizes from the one attack.

  • John DiCarlo

    As my friend says it, “Kyurem is not the main attacker. Feraligatr is the main attacker. Kyurem is to build up damage on everyone and have the ‘gater finish them off.”

    • Anonymous

      This seems like a rather slow and clunky approach. Especially as Gatr is difficult to stream. If you want Kyurem to be more of a starter, then for sure use the BlastZel based version of the deck. Blastoise is a far superior attacker to either Gatr

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_YKW66HHHNNYAPF4Q44XYCG4CBA Jared

    Also, though I’m not sure they are the best techs for kyurem, lunatone and solrock blocking blissey drops kill another very important aspect of the deck and it becomes dependent on seekers to remove damage off of the board.

  • Anonymous

    Kyurem is looking GREAT in the truth right now. Anyone else agree?

    • Anonymous

      I like it there, but I guess several people would disagree. :)

      • Anonymous

        Just the fact that it has outrage and can be searched for with collector makes it better than SEL imo. by the way i REALLY  like all of your articles. they’re always chock full of good info and crazy deck ideas. i built that Electrode/Alomomola/Zekrom/Tornadus deck because my brother needs a deck for regionals, I had all of the cards, and he refuses to play anything meta and it works like a CHARM!!! I finally have respect for the enlarged reverse pokeball. 

        • Anonymous

          Glad to hear! thanks for the kind words!

  • Anonymous

    Is water energy acceleration really necessary? how about electrode prime? before people troll, test it out.

    • Anonymous

      I think that it is. I absolutely get what you are saying and I love Electrode. I am having a blast with Electrode/Alomomola/Zekrom/Tornadus.

      However, since Kyurem is not OHKOing stuff you will lose Kyurems and will need to beable to stream them. This is difficult to pull off with Electrode. You would have to set up your bench with multiple Kyurems and power them up at once for it to be extremely effective.

      • Anonymous

        ya i understand what ur saying. maybe a 1-1 tech would be interesting…… 

  • Anonymous

    The Kyurem/F/B deck has 62 cards in it. Just saying.

    Other than that I really liked the article.

    • Anonymous

      Nah, the list has 60. I guess in editing the individual parts were miss added or just a typo in adding the totals to the different parts of the list. There are in fact only 20 Pokemon listed there.

      • Anonymous

        Oh I see.

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_6K5VBRLCY2WPSQW6OHPYC3KXYQ Matt

    Great article…I really appreciate the “forward” thinking of what the format may look like and seeing how new cards work.  The vileplume/Kyruem idea is very interesting – thanks for sharing.

  • http://twitter.com/mosherstomper Robby Gill

    first off. gatrs attack does 60+ 10 for each damage counter on the defending pokemon. not 80. if kyrum hit them once before hand it would do 90. not 80.

    not playing evolite with kyrum is a mistake. 
    playing the list with floatzel could be done but use shaymin not blastoise. adding a st2 just makes it slower with multiple floatzel. 

    ttar has so much potential in this format now. who plays serperior? what decks really play max potion? these options exsist but are they actually part of the meta?

    yanmega, donphan and goth are the only decks you can expect to play max potion. donphan isnt very popular since tornados. goth has 30 hp basics that hate darkness howl. yanmega is different and can take advantage of the howls to your bench.

    the only deck that “plays serp” is ttar varients.

    so ideally ttars biggest problems are being a s2 and healing itself. as well as trainer lock. and blissy. which is only played in ross/goth,

    • Anonymous

      Sorry about messing up the Feraligatr. I think it was a mental slip and I was thinking about the non-ability Gatr.

      Eviolite could work in a Kyurem deck, but like I have said many times before, I am not entirely sold on Eviolite. You can simply Catcher up other stuff and take out the energy support Pokemon. Then you 2HKO the Kyurem and the Kyurm player is in a tight spot because then it will be hard to stream Kyurem. It think it will be a good addition to the format, but I’m not sold on it being game breaking to the point of inclusion in every Basic Pokemon focus deck. Then again, I could be completely wrong here :)

      Obviously T-Tar is not a huge potential deck. It has not really gotten anything new form EP. So, there were options for it to be played at Nationals, Worlds, and Battle Roads. Yet, it never materialized. I think that says a lot.

      I feel that you miss the point about Max Potion. The point is not that decks play it now. If that was the only thing to be considered you would be correct. You would not expect it to be played a lot and T-Tar could run wild. The point is that Max Potion is a card that a TON of decks CAN run and it really messes with T-Tar. When there is a single card (like Max Potion) or an easy to implement tech line (like Blissey) that can ruin your deck, that deck will never truly become top tier. Because, if T-Tar would get popular, people would THEN run Max Potion and T-Tar would be pushed back.

      You might be able to score a surprise Top Cut with it, but once the cat’s out of the bag, decks will simply adjust.

  • Anonymous

    you forgot one of Ttar’s BEST partners: yanmega. 

    • Anonymous

      Meh… I get what you are saying, Darkness Howl then Linear Attack for the KO. The problem is that Yanmega also takes damage is already relatively fragile in this meta.

      There might be something to do there, but I honestly do not think that would be the optimal option.

      • Anonymous

        ttar-yanmega it is rendered obsolete by yanmega-kyurem, but the real great partners for Ttar aren’t here yet … dark rush will bring them.

        • Anonymous

          I agree with that statement. If T-Tar is going to get help, it will be from Dark Rush.

          Good luck if you are going to Regionals :)

  • Anonymous

    I went 5-3 at 2011 Regionals in Long Beach CA with my TYRANITAR, ZOROARK, UMBREON, ZEKROM, DARKRAI/CRESSELIA LEGEND DECK.

    Round 1: ZEKROM. WIN.
    It was close but in the end I spreaded 120 on everyone. Max Potion is the card of the day. :)

    Round 2: ZEKROM. LOSE
    I was dominating all game long. In the end, I just had a tyranitar active and a lone umbreon benched. I spreaded 100 on all his tornadus’s with just one more darkness howl from winning my last prizes while he only taken 2 prizes, but then he does something so tragic. lol He catchers my umbreon and then uses seeker. so now its just umbreon and his active zekrom with 100 damage on it, he uses outrage for the win. Sad lose I shouldve won if i only had another benched pokemon. haha Good Game.

    Round 3: DONPHAN/ MACHAMP. WIN.
    This was the match of the day for me. I was scared at first but I kept my poise. He evolved all his machops and phanphys to Machamp and Donphan which put a smile on my face cuz i had my umbreon ready. He was unaware of Umbreons MOONLIGHT FANG which pretty much messed him up. We both took 5 prizes. He just needed one energy to knock out my tyranitar but didnt pull it, so he tried to stall with cleffa. Cleffa is asleep. My turn, Tyranitar Power Claw for game. :) Good Game.

    Round 4: ZEKROM. WIN
    This one came easy. Set up Tyranitar turn 2 and from here on out, total domination lol Good Game.

    Round 5: GOTHETELLA. WIN
    He just had a lone baby goth active with no bench. I set up tyranitar turn 2, knock it out. Good Game.

    Round 6: ZEKROM. LOSE
    MISPLAY of the day.. :( I spreaded 100 on 2 tornadus’s and 120 on 2 zekroms and 40 on shaymin. Just 3 prizes for me to take with his 1. I had a half legend in hand, a rainbow, and a pokemon communication. I needed the other half of the legend to win. I draw, draw a zoroar, but I right away evolve my zorua. MISTAKE!! I asked if i could take it back but he said no. I was going to communication the zoroark for the last piece of the legend to win the game. He knocked me out when I ended my turn to win.

    Round 7: RESHIPHLOSION. WIN
    This was a good spread game with 120 on 2 reshiram and 2 typhlosions. Came down to each player with 1 prize left. I won with umbreon.

    Round 8: GOTHETELLA. LOSE
    I was dominating all game. took 5 prizes, but then he knocked out my last tyranitar which is my only weapon against gothetella. He had 8 psychic on his last gothetella which no way i couldnt bring down without tyranitar. one way to win was with my legend. i had half of the legend in hand and a rainbow. I had zoroark active, used nasty plot to find other half, IT WASNT THERE. :o UNBELIEVABLE. ALL HOPE WAS GONE. He won. Turns out the other half of the legend was in my discard pile due to using Tyranitars Magaton Tail which makes me discard top 3 cards of my deck. I forgot i discarded it. . Good Game. Trainer lock really helped him.